Can I get a travel ball history lesson?

[Rolling Hard]

And it's not just about the dollar Slugger is talking about. At some point these organizations realized there was money to be made (not just in softball, but in all youth sports). You get a team of 15 girls with parents willing to pay $2500 a piece, there's a way to make money there. You build in the competitive nature of parenting these days, and throw in private lessons lessons at 60/hr/ a couple of times a week. I think i ran out numbers a while ago that suggested a large organization could net 20 percent per team. Not a lot on its own, but when you have an 10U A and B,, a 12U A and B, a 14U A&B, a 16UA or B and an 18UA, that's potentially 67 grand in one town from just fees. Three or four different regions in a state, and a half dozen states and you're talking decent money.

But on order to make it, you have to convince people that the only reat path to success is through travel ball. The good news is you don't have to do anything -- the girls and the parents will do it for you. By 12 -- 14 at the latest -- girls who play rec are scoffed at, and making a high school team gets tough, not just because of skill but because the high school coach also coaches travel ball and already knows a lot fo the girls.

And then there's the tournaments. On our scale, 700 bucks per team, 10 teams a division, 9 or so divisions, that's 63,000 in revenue per tourney. Say the venue takes half and the walk in gate (200 people at 5 bucks per person per day, so another 2 grand), thats still 30K per weekend. Umps cost money, insurance costs money, but not 30K. And if you get into something like Sparkler -- 700 teams at 2500 each? A million seven. And that's not even counting stay to play kickbacks.

Travel ball grew because of money -- because some organizations realized they could convince parents that the sport had potentially more to offer than a couple games a week on an elementary school field. And to be fair, there's some truth to it. Stricter Title IX enforcement created programs in colleges all over the country and forced the sport out of California, and with more programs, came the possibility of scholarship money. Even without money, though, playing a sport gives a kid a better chance to get into some schools. Paranoid (justifiably) parenting makes parents try to push their kids into anything that might help, and what do you know? Plenty of people out there willing to say that softball might just be the ticket their daughter is looking for, but only if they take it seriously, play for the right program and in the right tournaments. Thus an industry is born.

 

[Rolling Hard]

A scenario I have seen many times...

A local rec all-star team has a good run during their summer all-star season. Maybe they won a couple of tournaments, and did well at their State championships. Coaches are pumped up, parents are happy, the players love each other. Everyone is feeling good. Then, the coaches pop the idea of keeping those happy feeling going, and keeping the team together, by becoming a TB team. To keep costs down, they don't join up with a major TB org, they stay independent as "Coast City Cyclones" . Sounds great, Coach

They start playing friendlies and tournaments, and proceed to get curb-stomped...repeatedly. Welcome to TB! The happy buzz starts wearing off. A few parents decide their princesses need to be on a team that wins, so they pull the plug and go find a new team. Now, the Cyclones have some holes to fill. Very likely, the players that left were some of the better players on the team. The Cyclones don't exactly have a well-known name, and a pretty ugly track record. Attracting quality talent is not likely, but the coaches need to fill the roster so the team can keep playing, so they take anyone who is willing to write a check. Maybe the coaches are pretty good, and they help the better athletes become pretty good players, but the scenario repeats.

A lot more often than not, these types of teams don't last very long.

This is so sadly true. You add in men with egos and pushy wives and many friendships are broken.

 

[Eric F]

This is so sadly true. You add in men with egos and pushy wives and many friendships are broken.

Tiger moms. Don't forget about the tiger moms.

 

[Quigs10]

A scenario I have seen many times...

A local rec all-star team has a good run during their summer all-star season. Maybe they won a couple of tournaments, and did well at their State championships. Coaches are pumped up, parents are happy, the players love each other. Everyone is feeling good. Then, the coaches pop the idea of keeping those happy feeling going, and keeping the team together, by becoming a TB team. To keep costs down, they don't join up with a major TB org, they stay independent as "Coast City Cyclones" . Sounds great, Coach

They start playing friendlies and tournaments, and proceed to get curb-stomped...repeatedly. Welcome to TB! The happy buzz starts wearing off. A few parents decide their princesses need to be on a team that wins, so they pull the plug and go find a new team. Now, the Cyclones have some holes to fill. Very likely, the players that left were some of the better players on the team. The Cyclones don't exactly have a well-known name, and a pretty ugly track record. Attracting quality talent is not likely, but the coaches need to fill the roster so the team can keep playing, so they take anyone who is willing to write a check. Maybe the coaches are pretty good, and they help the better athletes become pretty good players, but the scenario repeats.

A lot more often than not, these types of teams don't last very long.

This is so true and in its original intent...a great idea and something that I wish would work...but it does eventually get snuffed out by the behemoth orgs like Cruisers, Firecrackers, Batbusters, So Cal Athletics etc.

Both my 15 yr old and 11 yr old played/play local Rec ASA ball here in So Cal and yes eventually the better players need stronger competition...so as my older daughter was in between 10u and 12u she joined one of the huge "name Brand" teams in 10u and 12u made up of local All Star girls from 2 local Rec leagues. They stayed together for 3 yrs straight. The coach is a local HS coach with 2 decades of softball coaching and other sports.

But...my biggest problem with the huge orgs are that the younger ones pay all the $$ dues til 16u and the 16u 18u dont and reap the benefits. All the while the HS coach who has decades of experience has to do what the "Head Honcho" of the organization says.

I asked our coach "why in the hell do you listen to that guy who has less experience and knowledge of the game than you do? Why do you have to do what he says?"...So I looked up the main guy's background and he never played anything...he just started the org but has no actual prior coaching or playing experience....but now hes looked at as some sort of "guru" of softball? I just didnt get it why one guy called the shots who didn't have the knowledge. It always bugged me why people/coaches listened to him when he wasn't that knowledgeable. Never understood that part of the TB "scene". Why these "founders" of some orgs are treated like royalty...didn't make sense.

Now...my 11 yr old is at that time where we gotta make a decision. Rec ball is just AWFUL and she needs to play with better players...but we dont want to do the big org TB route again and pay $$$$$. A nice solid independent TB team in theory would be best option for many families like mine...but eventually the big orgs poach player after player. Plus my 11yr old remembers all the times she was woken up at 5am to hit the road to go to one of sisters games and the 3-5 games each weekend she would have to sit through. She wants no part of that....but doesnt want to play Rec anymore with girls who cant catch or throw either.

 

[osagedr]

That is an easy one. It is all about the $$$.

Up until the 1990s, the money was in men's slowpitch softball. There were several organizations that published ruled books for slowpitch. They organized state and national slowpitch tournaments. The organizations were the ASA, the NSA (Natioanal Softball Association, and the USSSA (United States Slowpitch Softball Association).

The only group with male and female fastpitch was the ASA. The ASA treated fastpitch as the red-headed stepchild.

In the 1990s, the ASA's national tournaments and national qualifiers were awful. There were *NO* pool games. It was strictly double elimination. The national tournaments were usually in California.

The California teams were light years ahead of softball in the US. So, basically, a team from Illinois or Virginia would qualify for the nationals, fly to California on Monday and be eliminated on the first day on Tuesday. And, the non-California were usually run ruled.

People complained. The ASA ignored them.

So, the AFA (American Fastpitch Association) became a competitor. The qualifiers and the national tournament had pool games along with the elimination tournaments. The AFA drew mainly from the southeast and Texas.

The NSA (National Softball Association) saw the growth in girls softball, and got in on the action. They started a tournament catering mainly to the southeast and eastern seaboard.

In 1999, the USSSA changed its name from United States Slowpitch Softball Association to the US "Specialiy Sports" Association and began offering fastpitch qualifiers. (My team won the first USSSA state championship in Illinois. We didn't even know it was a championship tournament. We win the last game, and we're packing up to go home, and the tournament director wanders over with this trophy about the size of a minivan. It weighed more than some of our players.)

The ASA finally woke up and realized it had lost market share, and started offering all kinds of national championships. Gold, A, B, C and then national championship tournaments for regions (I have never been able to figure that one out.)

The USSSA, the NSA and the ASA all had many national tournaments. It was Oprah for national championships: You win a national, and you win a national, and you win a national!

Through all the years, the one constant was baseball. (oh, wait, that line is from Field of Dreams, sorry...)

Through all the years, the one constant was the Orange County Batbusters. The OC Batbusters (Haning) are the New York Yankees of fastpitch softball.

Tired of making money for the ASA, USSSA and the NSA, the OC Batbusters decided to starts its own national championship. It said, "We aren't playing ASA any more. You want to play the best, you got to play in our national championship." And, the PGF (Premier Girls Fastpitch) was started.

Now, the best of the best fastpitch teams play in the PGF tournament. PGF has a TV contract, so it makes some $$$.

It is all about the dollar.

That's the best succinct overview I have ever seen. Thank you sincerely!

 

[Rolling Hard]

This is so true and in its original intent...a great idea and something that I wish would work...but it does eventually get snuffed out by the behemoth orgs like Cruisers, Firecrackers, Batbusters, So Cal Athletics etc.

Both my 15 yr old and 11 yr old played/play local Rec ASA ball here in So Cal and yes eventually the better players need stronger competition...so as my older daughter was in between 10u and 12u she joined one of the huge "name Brand" teams in 10u and 12u made up of local All Star girls from 2 local Rec leagues. They stayed together for 3 yrs straight. The coach is a local HS coach with 2 decades of softball coaching and other sports.

But...my biggest problem with the huge orgs are that the younger ones pay all the $$ dues til 16u and the 16u 18u dont and reap the benefits. All the while the HS coach who has decades of experience has to do what the "Head Honcho" of the organization says.

I asked our coach "why in the hell do you listen to that guy who has less experience and knowledge of the game than you do? Why do you have to do what he says?"...So I looked up the main guy's background and he never played anything...he just started the org but has no actual prior coaching or playing experience....but now hes looked at as some sort of "guru" of softball? I just didnt get it why one guy called the shots who didn't have the knowledge. It always bugged me why people/coaches listened to him when he wasn't that knowledgeable. Never understood that part of the TB "scene". Why these "founders" of some orgs are treated like royalty...didn't make sense.

Now...my 11 yr old is at that time where we gotta make a decision. Rec ball is just AWFUL and she needs to play with better players...but we dont want to do the big org TB route again and pay $$$$$. A nice solid independent TB team in theory would be best option for many families like mine...but eventually the big orgs poach player after player. Plus my 11yr old remembers all the times she was woken up at 5am to hit the road to go to one of sisters games and the 3-5 games each weekend she would have to sit through. She wants no part of that....but doesn't want to play Rec anymore with girls who cant catch or throw either.

I think I know who you are referring to. Many teams are started under this org. simply because they have the name, the insurance and uniforms. One stop shopping.

You are in So Cal so you have a ton of choices. Usually September, after pgf, new teams are formed and other teams are disbanded. There is a lot of movement/poaching /tryouts/guesting and another round of movement in January when the player/parents realize the team they joined in September isn't all what they thought is was going to be. This year because of covid-19 things are going to be different. How? nobody knows for sure. But I believe there will be fallout. Players quitting and teams looking for players. I suggest using it to your advantage, especially if your DD is talented. If she is pitcher, catcher or big bat you have a lot of leverage. Know what kind of team you want to be on. Do you want a pgf or die coach that yells and berates the players? Some parent do! Do you want to play every weekend except Mothers Day? Some do. Tryout/guest for numerous teams. Guesting is the best way to see a team. Many coaches will have your DD guest sight unseen. This may or may not be a sign of weakness. Do not be afraid to ask the coach questions. How often do you play/practice. Where do you play? What tourneys are on your schedule? How many players on the roster? Where do you see my DD fitting in on your team? How much are dues and start ups? I personally do not like spending big money on start ups. IMO, requiring team bags, helmets, cleats, bats, gym bags, hairbows, visors, wristbands, ect for a 10u team that you probably won't be on next year is a cost I can do without. Find a team that best matches you and your DD.

 

[wheresmycar]

Nobody has mentioned, the college programs offering worthless verbal commitments to kids still in middle school... Parents hear those stories, and are filled with panic their kid is going to be left behind... and put their first year 8u into a "top tier" TB program, and start writing checks...

Glad the new recruiting rules are in place.

 

[radness]

Nobody has mentioned, the college programs offering worthless verbal commitments to kids still in middle school... Parents hear those stories, and are filled with panic their kid is going to be left behind... and put their first year 8u into a "top tier" TB program, and start writing checks...

Glad the new recruiting rules are in place.

Every student and player worked with and coached who had early recruitment offers were honored and colleges followed through.

Remember all verbals are still an open ended non binding conversation!

In addition to no more early recruitment...
Players can now transfer colleges and play same year, without having to sit out a season befor playing.

 

[sluggers]

Every student and player worked with and coached who had early recruitment offers were honored and colleges followed through.

You work with some of the best catchers in the US. I Any sane college coach would want one of your kids.

Under the old system, the problem occurred when Coach Suzy at Low-Level U. made a commitment, and then Coach Suzy got a new job at Mid-Level U (or was fired). The new coach at Low-Level U would often renege on the verbal.

 

[The Man In Blue]

Why does travel ball have to be the best of the best, players looking to play high level college softball? Very very few softball players go on to play at the collegiate level.

The more softball players playing travel is a good thing. Travel ball is filling a need in areas that rec league and high school softball are not fulfilling.

Travel ball doesn't have to be the best of the best ... but it still pretends it is the best of the best.

I have mixed thoughts on your statement that "travel ball is filling a need in areas that rec league and high school ball aren't fulfilling." While true in some areas, travel ball is what caused that deficit in the first place. I can't view it as some hero "filling the need". It won a brand war.

I wish there was a focus back on "community" ball with room for both rec and travel programs. I believe that is where the need is. (My bias: I was working on developing a program like this when I and several allies got fed up and walked away from our respective local orgs.)