The rear leg

NoonTime said:

Jbooth (any anyone else who likes to play along at home),
When you stand up, feet shoulder width apart, weight evenly distributed, knees bent, facing a wall, toes pointed at wall and hips facing wall... can you move your right thigh (femur) back and forth with IR and ER action? Your feet remain pointed at the wall, the weight remains relatively evenly distributed, and your hips do not turn (nor do they shift laterally) but the relationship between femur and socket changes. Your knee will move in space going from a "knock-kneed" position when the femur is in IR to a "bow-legged" position when the femur is in an ER position. I think this movement is not abduction or adduction as there is no lateral shifting of the hips or shifting of weight, it's just an IR to ER and back to IR movement of the femur in the socket. Are you with me? Can you replicate this movement?
Cheers,
Noontime

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jbooth said:

From the position that you describe; Moving to knock-kneed is an adduction movement of the femur, and moving the knee out is abduction. To internally rotate, or externally rotate from that position, the foot must pivot.

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NoonTime said:

So what you are saying is that when I am in the athletic stance with my knees bent, that muscle action causing that movement I describe is really adduction and abduction. I am with you. Thank you for clarifying that. Similarly, if I was seated in a chair and I did the same movement from knock-kneed to bow-legged, that muscle action is abduction and adduction.

Really what we are talking about is the resulting movement from abduction and adduction while the femur is in a flexed position yes?

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redhotcoach said:

I also agree. That is why I have been asking to see ANY of the research that "scientists and PHDS have done." Including the differences between a beginners swing and the best hitters swing. The only phds I have seen talk about it are Chris and Tom.

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NoonTime said:

JBooth, any follow up on this?

The inward "bump" that Stanton does before this BP swing is adduction yes?

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pstein said:

I believe Tom (if you mean Tom Guerry) is a M.D. Also, there have been a number of books written on the scientific side of it. The Physics of Baseball, by Robert K. Adair explains the physics of the swing. His description could use some work, but he's a physicist, not a baseball coach.

Another one is The Scientific Approach to Hitting by Dr. Coop DeRenne. I haven't read this one, so I can't comment upon it.

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redhotcoach said:

Sorry...got the degree wrong...my main point was that someone says every few months that I don't match the research of scientists... But has not provided any of the research that I don't match.

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pstein said:

I'm not jbooth, but Stanton's inward "bump" is adduction.

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Lenski said:

Here's some light reading for those interested. This study, as Mann and jbooth point out in their posts, is that it is not the rear leg, rather the pelvic (hip) region that provides power. The rear leg initiates the stride, and once the stride is complete (heel plant) the rear leg is basically done, but it did it's job in stretching the external hip rotator muscles, which reside in the hip socket area, allowing compression of these muscles in the actual hip rotation movement. This study also proves that hitters do not throw their hands, rather it is the front shoulder and elbow that initiates the forward portion of the swing as the trail arm's elbow drops, but that would be more appropriate in another thread.

Anyhoo.....the results start at Chapter 4.

http://scholarlyrepository.miami.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1550&context=oa_dissertations

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MTS said:

I don't think anyone would argue that by heel plant the rear leg is basically done....the swing is done at that point....unless you are a front foot hitter...

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