Two Lookback Ruling Questions

[Ajaywill]

Goobie, what a timely post.... DD was called out this weekend on exactly the play that you described. I would not have worded it any differently. She rounded first looked for the ball, found it was with the pitcher and returned to first. PU said she hesitated too long.... Her hesitation was less than 1 second while she was finding who was in possession of the ball.

So the umpire called the play correctly, you just disagree with his judgement of "immediately" return or advance after stopping......

 

[knightsb]

So the umpire called the play correctly, you just disagree with his judgement of "immediately" return or advance after stopping......

Yes, I do. It seemed like a bad call IMO, as the batter-runner rounded first stopped looked for the ball and returned. I am certain in this case there is a difference in opinion as to what "immediately" meant.

It really felt like the PU was looking for an opportunity to interject that call somewhere and I suppose he got his opportunity too. We have seen the exact same play a thousand times.

Funny how they can make that call but are reluctant to call any illegal pitches.



Sec 2. The LOOK-BACK RULE is in effect when the ball is live, the batter-runner
has touched first base or has been declared out, and the pitcher has possession
of the ball (e.g. has the ball in their hand, glove, under arm or chin, between
their legs) within the 16-foot circle.
Any runner(s) in motion may continue without stopping or may stop once, but
then must immediately move directly back to the last base touched or attempt
to advance to the next base.
Once the runner stops at a base for any reason, they may not move off that
base.

 

[Umpireernie]

The question I have to ask about the OP before throwing these umpires under the bus is exactly how long did these runners stop. "Immediately" is a judgement call and is in the eye of the beholder. But it's not long at all. If a batter-runner is going to 1B after a walk and the ball is back in the circle before the batter-runner gets even halfway to 1B and the batter-runner (now a runner once she passes 1B) rounds 1B and does anything more than either continue or change direction and return nonsop to 1B we will have an LBR out. Simply changing directions IS stopping, albeit for a very short time. If the runner paused long enough that someone writing about it in a softball forum takes time to mention that she stopped, my guess is this may have been a good call.

"It was less than one second..." Well, that's good becuase one second would be WAY too long if the ball is being held in the circle! Again, if it was long enough to be described as "less than a second" then my guess is that is was longer than "immediately".

 

[Country Boy]

Daughter got called on this one in a Regional Game here this week. Walked to first, and turned to second, but left foot was still on 1B. She had not rounded, just pivoted. She found ball and when she picked up her left foot to step toward foul line to converse with coach, umpire called her out. She was all but standing on the bag.

That was bad enough but the manner in which he made the call was annoying. He came running in from the outfield grass pointing, waving his arms, attracting everyone's attention. Yells out his call. Makes more gestures. When you look up 'Egotistical Umpires' in the dictionary, there is a picture of him. He made this call all about him.

In a game a couple weeks ago, an umpire told us that even though the rule stated 'immediately', they had been instructed in training to allow up to 2 seconds for the runner to commit. And bad umpires wonder why they take abuse from fans and coaches...

 

[Umpireernie]

Geez, that pretty much sucks CB. Sadly, in any group of people including umpires, a portion of the group are going to be egotistical idiots.

Yes, making a LBR call needs to be a bit vocal to start, as you have to kill play and get everyone's attention. But then it is short and sweet.

And the play as you describe should never be called a LBR. Neither should losing contact with the bag while moving from one foot to the other.

 

[Umpireernie]

Two seconds? Wow! Is this like 10u class C or something? That's an eternity in LBR time!

 

[shockcoach]

That was bad enough but the manner in which he made the call was annoying. He came running in from the outfield grass pointing, waving his arms, attracting everyone's attention. Yells out his call. Makes more gestures. When you look up 'Egotistical Umpires' in the dictionary, there is a picture of him. He made this call all about him.

That is what we refer to as a 'stadium call'.

 

[Mr T]

So in first scenario runner is allowed to round base and immediately come back? That is good to know because I've definitively heard bad info on this, saying once you take a step towards second on a walk you must keep going.

 

[GunnerShotgun]

So if batter walks on ball four, rounds first base and pauses, then goes to second...can that runner round second? Can they go to third? Can they pause at third and then go home (all one one play).

While this is not probable (all on one play), is it legal?

Hope that makes sense.

 

[shockcoach]

So if batter walks on ball four, rounds first base and pauses, then goes to second...can that runner round second? Can they go to third? Can they pause at third and then go home (all one one play).

While this is not probable (all on one play), is it legal?

Hope that makes sense.

Assuming that no play was made on the runner, no, they can't. You can stop once.