Small colleges - MPH

[MNDad]

Does speed determine a pitchers effectiveness? Ask yourselves this question (as many college coaches do):
Who would you rather have as a pitcher?
1: girl who can bring the heat at 63-64 MPH and leans on her FB
2: girl who hovers around 58-60 who can hit her spots and has good breaking pitches?

Me personally, I take pitcher 2 every time

I would take #2, but only if we’re talking actual game pitching speeds. Too often parents/coaches cite pitching speeds as the peak ever reached in practice including adjustments for radar guns that “read low”. Most of the girls with true 58-60 breaking pitches have fastballs well above 60.

 

[DmystifieD]

for those of us with DD's are are #2, that 58-60 range, hits spots all day, curve is pretty sweet......where do you expect to find yourself in college? top 26-50 team? 51- 100 team? D2? D3? not opposed to any division actually, so much to gain academic wise in D3...just want to know, now that we are almost done with sophomore year, where your DD ended up that was that girl hovering 58-60 with movement. All I hear is PAC12 for the most part is you have to be 63+. I think for PACc/SEC and maybe Big 10 that makes sense in theory....how about other conferences? like Conference USA? Big Sky? Sun Belt? Atlantic Sun? Mountain West? are there 58-60 players there plentiful? or are faster hurlers that are leaning on the Fastball still preferred in conferences like this? Thanks in advance.

 

[sluggers]

for those of us with DD's are are #2, that 58-60 range, hits spots all day, curve is pretty sweet......where do you expect to find yourself in college?

A pitcher at any D1 college has to (1) hit spots, (2) change speeds, and (3) have a vertically breaking pitch.

I know two pitchers who throw around 60 MPH and who will be playing at mid-major D1s next year. Both can do 2 of 3. They are actively working to develop the 3rd.

A girl who as a freshman is pitching *some* at a mid-level D1 was "ok" at all 3 aspects.

So, the pitcher you described isn't competitive *now* at a mid-level D1 right now. You didn't say anything about a change, so I'm assuming she has a decent change. She has to develop a vertically breaking pitch...either a rise or a drop. She might find a team willing to work with her to develop the drop or rise.

She will probably pick up 2 or 3 MPH in college...maybe more, depending upon how hard she works. *BUT*-if she isn't pitching during games, she probably will be less motivated to work. It is the nature of the beast.

She might be able to play immediately on a mid-level D2. Again, the lack of a vertical breaking pitch is a big problem, so she won't be a "star" at the D2 level.

She would be able to pitch immediately on a top 25 D3 team. I doubt she would be able to play on a top 5 D3 school.

 

[Rocketech1]

A pitcher at any D1 college has to (1) hit spots, (2) change speeds, and (3) have a vertically breaking pitch.

I know two pitchers who throw around 60 MPH and who will be playing at mid-major D1s next year. Both can do 2 of 3. They are actively working to develop the 3rd.

A girl who as a freshman is pitching *some* at a mid-level D1 was "ok" at all 3 aspects.

So, the pitcher you described isn't competitive *now* at a mid-level D1 right now. You didn't say anything about a change, so I'm assuming she has a decent change. She has to develop a vertically breaking pitch...either a rise or a drop. She might find a team willing to work with her to develop the drop or rise.

She will probably pick up 2 or 3 MPH in college...maybe more, depending upon how hard she works. *BUT*-if she isn't pitching during games, she probably will be less motivated to work. It is the nature of the beast.

She might be able to play immediately on a mid-level D2. Again, the lack of a vertical breaking pitch is a big problem, so she won't be a "star" at the D2 level.

She would be able to pitch immediately on a top 25 D3 team. I doubt she would be able to play on a top 5 D3 school.

Who are these pitchers in HS that can throw 60mph but don't have a vertical pitch? What have they been working on for 6 years? a fastball and change-up and maybe an occasional curve ball?

I purposely waited until DD was 12 to have her PC introduce breaking pitches but now, 12 months later, her 4-seam "fastball" has become her peel drop (easy and natural transition) and she has been working on a riseball, screwball, and curve every practice and uses them in games. She only throws in the low 50's but I imagine that these pitches will be very effective come HS and she will continue to work both vertically and horizontally in the zone.

 

[MNDad]

The big difference between the divisions (D1, D2, D3) is the variance in talent level between teams within that division. There are few really bad D1 teams. There are lots of really bad D3 teams. The top 10 teams in D2 probably are top 50 teams in D1. The top 10 teams in D3 are probably top 20 teams in D2.

The pitcher you described isn't competitive *now* at a mid-level D1 right now. She has to develop a vertically breaking pitch...either a rise or a drop. She might find a team willing to work with her to develop the drop or rise.

She might be able to play immediately on a mid-level D2. Again, the lack of a vertical breaking pitch is a big problem, so she won't be a "star" at the D2 level.

She would be able to pitch immediately on a top 25 D3 team. I doubt she would be able to play on a top 5 D3 school.

I think ranking the top 10 D2 schools with the top 50 D1 schools is far too generous. Even 150 is a stretch if we're talking about all ten.

Based on RPI rankings - Louisville (51), Nebraska (54), Ole Miss (55), and Stanford (72) I don’t think you can count even the top D2 schools in that group.

 

[sluggers]

Yeah...you might be right. It is hard to tell.

Valdosta State probably could beat some D1 teams...maybe they would be right in the middle of the D1 pack.

 

[riseball]

All top-notch college pitchers have both a vertical movement pitch and a horizontal moving pitch. The zone is squeezed on the top, but there is still some room east-west. You have to back those girls off the plate with something moving into them, not just up and down. I just watched games by TF at Mizzou. Game where she did not use her screw (EE hates the pitch but it is her bread and butter pitch prior), she struggled. Came back and threw some screws, along with the others, and did well. Not to mention having one or two changes of speed (CW), which was just skirted over. The backup to CW struggled with just a drop and came back with a curve and drop the next day.

Most college pitchers have all their hard pitches a few mph of each other, and their drop will be faster than a FB. Since one I know does not throw a FB in games, her rise is faster than her FB. So let's be realistic.

Once again OLIF you are wrong. Some, maybe even most, but not all pitchers. What you think things are or should be does not make it so.

 

[sluggers]

Rise, I gotta nothing but love for you, but OILF is right.

She said:

All top-notch college pitchers have both a vertical movement pitch and a horizontal moving pitch.

So, riseball, name me a top-notch college pitcher without a vertical movement pitch?

 

[Sparky Guy]

Rise, I gotta nothing but love for you, but OILF is right.

She said:



So, riseball, name me a top-notch college pitcher without a vertical movement pitch?

Gotta agree with Sluggers here. With the shrunken strike zone at the top and bottom in the NCAA, a pitcher has to be able to move the ball East-West. They changed the zone going into my DD's senior year. She had to move from her rise to using her screw more that season. She used more curves too. They would routinely have to remove 3 or 4 balls from the game because of cuts in the ball from curves being fouled off of the end of the bat.

 

[CoogansBluff]

I think ranking the top 10 D2 schools with the top 50 D1 schools is far too generous. Even 150 is a stretch if we're talking about all ten.

Based on RPI rankings - Louisville (51), Nebraska (54), Ole Miss (55), and Stanford (72) I don’t think you can count even the top D2 schools in that group.

fwiw, the Massey Ratings - which analyze all scores including the limited inter-division play between D-I and D-II - ranks Valdosta State (the #1 D-II team) at #95 overall nationally and North Alabama (the #10 D-II team) at #197. So the mathematical estimate is that D-II's top 10 teams would fall roughly 100-200 in D-I.