Release point

[Ken B]

Speaking of good PC's... If FFS ever opens up shop as a PC, I'd sign up DD...

 

[Curveball King]

Curveball... you're new to posting on this site. So welcome. I really hope you are asking for the reasons you state. As a pseudo-cagey veteran on here... the name "Curveball King"... is similar to Screwball... which is synonymous with OILF. I hope you are an individual and not her third personality... as she has tried to lambaste the 2-step in utter futility... posting imaginary percentages of pitchers that do not use it... and saying that gym steps are the preferred movements of the next anti-Christ... all the while repeatedly defining 'false load' incorrectly.

I tell you this because you're new... and understand that I'm sorta reserved... as I've no interest in debating with multiple personalities. So, sorry if I seem sorta ornery.

I'm not an expert and would never claim to be... but you will find that many of the quality posters on here aren't afraid to stick there neck out there... and back up their statements with what they believe is proof (right or wrong). Simply saying that a pitcher is all goofy because of his posture... or that a you're not sure about a drill... is fine and all... but sorta limiting... as to the quality of conversation it can lead to.

I just want you to know, that each and every question you asked... is answered in the video... and the thread... repeatedly. The explanations I have provided well exceed the canned answers I could provide in a single post (in response to your questions). In addition to that, I've posted numerous videos of the 2-step motion performed by high-level pitchers. I really recommend that you read that thread (Drive Mechanics) in search of your answers... as I'm cool with debate/discussion... but not at the expense of duplicating that work - when it's all there in one repository (fairly well organized). If you still have questions after looking through that thread.. and considering what Ken, Pumpkinbear, Doug, etc... have posted on here, let me know.

Again, welcome to the site... really hope you become a great contributor!

Not sure I'm understanding what you are saying. I don't think I agreed with oilf at all? I said pitchers definitely so the two step. Nor do I think your drill promotes gym foot...I just question the need for it above and beyond the rthyme drill. I think you misunderstand my intentions. And if I ask a question I would rather it just get answered if possible. I don't think I have to read an entire thread to get an answer. I have read your drive mechanics thread and its over the top. Lotta info and most of it I already know about. I like the work out portion. I feel its something that's sorely overlooked. Thanks for that as well.

 

[Ken B]

****WARNING: Thread hi-jack in progress****

Ask me how great my curve ball was!

How great was your curveball? In all sincerity, I'll bring up an old CB thread in hopes you'll post your experience/input there. Seems like many (most) who say they throw a CB have more of a semi-spiral, angled pitch...

**** End hi-jack ****

 

[Curveball King]

Baseball and I agree Ken...in softball at all levels movement is over stated.

 

[Ken B]

Dang! I was kinda hoping you were Jeremy Manley or another men's FP pitcher...

 

[javasource]

Not sure I'm understanding what you are saying. I don't think I agreed with oilf at all? I said pitchers definitely so the two step. Nor do I think your drill promotes gym foot...I just question the need for it above and beyond the rthyme drill. I think you misunderstand my intentions. And if I ask a question I would rather it just get answered if possible. I don't think I have to read an entire thread to get an answer. I have read your drive mechanics thread and its over the top. Lotta info and most of it I already know about. I like the work out portion. I feel its something that's sorely overlooked. Thanks for that as well.

Sorry for taking this thread off-topic... it was never my intention.

Curveball... frankly... you've me a little confused. Understand that I'm not attacking you... there's just a bunch of mixed signals you're throwing out there. You ask one thing... then state another.

You asked why it was better. That's a matter of opinion... to which you are definitely entitled, and I respect that. Not asking for anyone to buy anything... it's all free on here.

You asked why it's better than a rhythm drill... It is a rhythm drill. There's a whole section on establishing a rhythm in the video. Which is why I'm confused... as you've stated that you've read the entire thread and watched the video. Perhaps you meant rocking?... but even then... I explain that in the video. Same thing with the gym-step... that's addressed, too... but you're asking what it is. It's just difficult to hear things like: "What's this?" Vs. "I already know a lot of it"... as they conflict. I had read all your posts prior to responding... I hope you can appreciate the confusion on my part.

You asked about legal footwork drill... and this is probably where I should've answered directly... but again... didn't want to hijack the thread. Understand that the drill is about TEACHING weight transfer, momentum, and establishing a baseline in a pitch for timing...

So... how would you teach it (seriously)?

My thoughts? In nearly ALL (95%+) high-level pitchers... they transfer weight TO the back foot at some point in the pitch. Not some. All. Pause or not... they then transfer ALL (not some) weight to the front foot (drive foot) to PUSH FROM the rubber. So again... the teach? Do you teach a motion that does not GUARANTEE weight transfer and establishing momentum... and does not guarantee the hardest push from the rubber possible? The rocking motion is a great example. In MANY rockers... you'll see that they never FULLY transfer weight between feet (i.e false load)... instead they maintain some level of weight on both feet at all times. Couple that with a lean... and all you have is a rolling start. On the DM thread... here's a post about that...

So... what other methods would you suggest? I fully admit that my drill is not the end-all, be-all.. but.. if done correctly.. is a GUARANTEED method to teach weight transfer... so that they can fly off the rubber and IMPROVE THEIR TIMING. Perhaps an illustration (also found in the DM thread)... how do you get a girl to do this with the drive foot (explode off the rubber)?

Another serious question for you... How important is timing in a pitch? If you believe it is... how would/do you teach/correct it?

Here's the link to the actual post of the 2-step. Every question you've asked is summed up nicely for you. Perhaps you missed it the first time through. No biggie. But I assure you... it's all there (at least my opinion, that is).

Hopefully I've answered your questions. If not... post them on that thread... or simply send me a PM. I'd be more than willing to continue to discuss this matter with you... but maybe it's best to do it 'on topic' in a thread. Thanks for the kind words, too.

Lastly, OILF's constant statements about the 'new era' of pitchers is right on par with all her others. Monica is the best to ever play the game (IMO)... and she still does. Welcome to the board... hopefully you haven't received too many PM's from Screwball.

Best, ~JS

 

[1bucketmom]

As much as I have read each of the critical "sticky" threads, there is always something new I pick up when I go back a re-read them. The art of pitching includes the constant evolution of one's understanding of the finer points. This does not happen overnight or in one reading. Like reading "Old Man and the Sea".....it's a great book but the second or third time through you pick up on the nuances and symbolism. Read and reread and then repeat.

I also learn a ton from people posting vids and asking/answering questions. In the end, we (most) are looking for the same thing....advance our kids and advance the quality of the sport.

 

[Doug Romrell]

I'm working on this Abbott two-step with one of my pitching students....the one with lazy legs......AND, it's really helping her.

 

[Curveball King]

Sorry for taking this thread off-topic... it was never my intention.

Curveball... frankly... you've me a little confused. Understand that I'm not attacking you... there's just a bunch of mixed signals you're throwing out there. You ask one thing... then state another.

You asked why it was better. That's a matter of opinion... to which you are definitely entitled, and I respect that. Not asking for anyone to buy anything... it's all free on here.

You asked why it's better than a rhythm drill... It is a rhythm drill. There's a whole section on establishing a rhythm in the video. Which is why I'm confused... as you've stated that you've read the entire thread and watched the video. Perhaps you meant rocking?... but even then... I explain that in the video. Same thing with the gym-step... that's addressed, too... but you're asking what it is. It's just difficult to hear things like: "What's this?" Vs. "I already know a lot of it"... as they conflict. I had read all your posts prior to responding... I hope you can appreciate the confusion on my part.

You asked about legal footwork drill... and this is probably where I should've answered directly... but again... didn't want to hijack the thread. Understand that the drill is about TEACHING weight transfer, momentum, and establishing a baseline in a pitch for timing...

So... how would you teach it (seriously)?

My thoughts? In nearly ALL (95%+) high-level pitchers... they transfer weight TO the back foot at some point in the pitch. Not some. All. Pause or not... they then transfer ALL (not some) weight to the front foot (drive foot) to PUSH FROM the rubber. So again... the teach? Do you teach a motion that does not GUARANTEE weight transfer and establishing momentum... and does not guarantee the hardest push from the rubber possible? The rocking motion is a great example. In MANY rockers... you'll see that they never FULLY transfer weight between feet (i.e false load)... instead they maintain some level of weight on both feet at all times. Couple that with a lean... and all you have is a rolling start. On the DM thread... here's a post about that...

So... what other methods would you suggest? I fully admit that my drill is not the end-all, be-all.. but.. if done correctly.. is a GUARANTEED method to teach weight transfer... so that they can fly off the rubber and IMPROVE THEIR TIMING. Perhaps an illustration (also found in the DM thread)... how do you get a girl to do this with the drive foot (explode off the rubber)?

Another serious question for you... How important is timing in a pitch? If you believe it is... how would/do you teach/correct it?

Here's the link to the actual post of the 2-step. Every question you've asked is summed up nicely for you. Perhaps you missed it the first time through. No biggie. But I assure you... it's all there (at least my opinion, that is).

Hopefully I've answered your questions. If not... post them on that thread... or simply send me a PM. I'd be more than willing to continue to discuss this matter with you... but maybe it's best to do it 'on topic' in a thread. Thanks for the kind words, too.

Lastly, OILF's constant statements about the 'new era' of pitchers is right on par with all her others. Monica is the best to ever play the game (IMO)... and she still does. Welcome to the board... hopefully you haven't received too many PM's from Screwball.

Best, ~JS

Java


I don't suggest any other method of pitching... What are you saying....I statd that i agree with you...I only said I don't know how affective the drill is...guess what I used it today with a chronic foot turner and its working...I emphasize the stick of the toe in the ground and for some reason its clicking... She doesn't turn the foot anymore while doing this drill. I had her step back ..drag her drive foot..over exaggerate the sticking of the drive foot and explode forward....it works. Then to full motion...emphasize sticking the drag foot toe in the ground...again...zero turn of the foot. So OK...I found a use for this drill with this particular student.

 

[Balls]

Here's the front shot. I think this guy's mechanics are quite impressive in spite of the fact it falls a little to his left just after release.

This pitcher is Andrew Kirkpatrick from ACT Australia.
He is the number 2 Mens pitcher behind his team mate and fellow ACT pitcher Adam Folkard.
I have put a gun on him and he throws around 80mph.
He is one of the few international mens pitchers who only strides out although he is 6'7.
80mph is still quick for mens softball but the most impressive thing I like about Andrews pitching is his movement and control.