Question for ASA...why South Dakota...or Midland, or Moline, or Bloomington......

[TheRogue]

I mean, really, let's face it. It's ridiculous. Our organization has a goal for all teams to qualify and attend ASA Nationals each year. That's great. Our 14U team has been 2x at 12U and last year as 1st year 14's, and have every intention of going to South Dakota this year.......unless, of course, we can get a PGF berth.

Moline, IL. Bloomington, IN. Midland, TX. Sioux Falls, SD.

What do all these places have in common? Let's see.....

1. Less traveled airports = higher plane ticket prices.

2. Smaller hotel options = higher motel rates.

3. Less rental vehicle options = higher rental car rates.

4. Less dining options = more crowded at the popular places trying to cram the team in.


Sioux Falls this year. Need to travel in no later than Saturday, July 28, since the team needs to be checked in no later than 2pm on Sunday.....especially if you are flying across the country.

You normally get 1 game Monday and 1 game Tuesday.

Depending how it goes, you may or may not get one or two games on Wednesday and/or Thursday.

So now, in the worst case scenario, your team has been in Sioux Falls 6 nights, and played 4 games. If you get a good draw and you play well, you have a good shot at Friday or even into Saturday.

Did I mention that at this tournament, you are required to use their hotels? Oh....and you cannot reserve one of their rooms until AFTER you have proof you qualified? Of course, if you are in the NW where the qualifiers don't come until July......good chance it's Red Roof Inn or Motel 6 because that's all that is left. Oh, also, since Sioux Falls is a small airport, one of the major carriers doesn't even fly out on Sundays!

ASA.....how about thinking about the costs to the teams and the parents at the younger ages? Why not Denver, St. Louis...or even Dallas, TX where there's actually main flight hubs and a lot larger infrastructure? At what point do the costs price you out? Why would it be set up for a team to possibly/likely be in an area for 6 nights, and only play 4 games? Don't tell me it's because there's so much to do in the down time. I've been to the other places above....and there isn't.

I realize that MTR is going to crucify me on this post, but I'd sure like to hear his reasoning behind this stuff. I know the answers I've been given before by others, but I would like to see the official story.

 

[MTR]

Why should I crucify you? You are obviously don't know, so I'll try to help.

With the exception of the 18U Gold and the SP Championship Series, all locations are based upon an open bid two seasons out.

Let's address the big city issue first. They don't care. There is nothing any national tournament can offer these big cities. You can have 6 months of set-up, 100+ teams and there isn't half of what one professional or big time college football or basketball game brings to the city. Their convention folks will help, but it will not be a priority. And even more simply, they have no interest to bid on them.

There are also a lot of places, I suspect more in the East than other areas, where the tax revenue is based on land use, not income or sales taxes. In my area, the local county has simply told the softball community that they really don't care and will offer no support. That includes the use of employees on the weekend even if the organization offers to pay the full rate. They just don't care as there is nothing which benefits them.

At each National Council Meeting, the list of cities/town/counties that will be offering a bid for each tournament in which they are interested is given to each attendee. These locations are pre-approved to insure what is being offered qualifies (enclosed fields, fence distances, etc.). This includes the tournament entry fee, the amount being offered ASA per team and additional guarantees. Also, include the rating the most recent tournment received along with the number of complexes to be used and the number of fields available, including those with lights. It also offers a breakdown of the previous year's ratings by that from the ASA Rep, UIC & the National Office, the number of teams and responses from the teams.

For the territorial NCs, only the council members from that territory may vote on those bids. For the USA/ASA Nationals, all members vote until one location receives more than 50% of the vote. For each round they drop bidders from the bottom and continue this process until one receives the appropriate # of votes. BTW, only about 20% of the time does the high bid prevail. And yes, there are deals made in the hallway that usually results in a bidder dropping out for consideration at another tournament.

There is also quite a few that does not draw any bidders. These are assigned to a special events committee which interact with potential host cities where often there is no guarantee or fees paid to ASA.

As much as you probably consider these as some podunk towns, most do an excellent job in running their tournaments. Is it true they are not vacation spots? Maybe, but that would depend on how people perceive a vacation. Some actually like to venture away from the big city, bright lights. Then again, I've always been under the impression everyone is there to play ball.

As much as people try to portray ASA as an ivory-tower entity, it is probably one of the more democratically operated organizations in the country. ASA doesn't make the decision on these issue. If a big city or vacation destination wants the tournaments, all they have to do is bid.

 

[TheRogue]

I agree....and I don't. If eveyone is there to play ball, can you address the 4 games in 6 days?

Maybe its time to change the formula? Instead of having bids come in.....go directly to these more cost effective areas and negotiate? The way you are describing it, it's almost like big cities couldn't host a tournament because they don't want it. Tell that to the Triple Crown World Series....they're hosting a 140+ team tournament in San Diego this summer. The Denver area will be hosting around 500 teams in multiple tournaments over the 4th of July. St. Louis will be hosting a 120 team tournament in October and again in November. Of course Florida has big tournaments as well.

If ASA simply asks for bids from state ASA groups, and then ASA votes on the bids, and as you admit there are the negotiations in the hall....will anything ever change?

I understand the Sioux Falls has some nice complexes/fields. That's great! So do a lot of other places that are much more cost-effective.

If it's all about playing ball......put the committee in charge of coming up with a better solution. PGF is on the right track; there's no reason to spend 7+ days to play, for 1/2 of the teams, 4 games. If our team stays at the same type of hotel we stay at for most tournaments, and do the same van rental as we do for most tournaments, then we're looking at $1500 per player for this one tournament....and that doesn't even buy the t-shirt.

 

[Atlantabell]

When I brought this up to our state director, all he could tell me was that Moline, Sioux Falls, Midland,etc got rave reviews for their fields, organization, etc. He didn't want to hear about how much the travel cost to get there, how the hotels were difficult to get near the location, and other negatives. So, we won't be going to ASA Nationals again this year. I just can't ask my parents to pay that expensive bill for possibly JUST four games, when we can go to another nationals and get at least six games. BTW, I am not looking for a vacation spot, just a place to play ball against top notch competition that doesn't cost an arm and a leg

There are lots of democratically run organizations that make very poor decisions. What does ASA do to solicit bids? How hard do they work at getting locations interested?

I think the bigger problem here is that ASA keeps doing the same thing over and over again and then they hope for a different result. I think it is time for them to think creatively and do something different. Why not ASK people what organizations they choose for nationals and WHY they go there?

Locally, I get beat up because I put my schedule out early for tournaments and then I am already booked when ASA tournaments are being run in my state. My local director tells me, " No one decides their schedule before February." REALLY? Because I have mine done, for the most part, by the first of the year.

I WANT to support ASA more, but I don't get the feeling that ASA really wants our team or organization's input. I don't think they really care about what travel ball coaches say. They just want to keep making the same, poor, democratic decisions.

Sorry.....jmo

 

[starsnuffer]

Other organizations are run as a business. ASA is run as a loose conglomeration. When you enable a democracy, you perform as the lowest common denominator. A lot of people prefer this to simply being told what to do by experts though.


-W

 

[JAD]

All of the "issues" brought up by TheRogue are EXACTLY why the teams in CA formed Premier and why some of the top teams in the country are headed to Huntington Beach!

 

[BrianMonk]

I think the number of games/day early on is a valid concern. Way too much down time.

Does anyone know how much weather plays a factor in that scheduling? If you lose a day due to weather, it's very hard to make that up if you have a compressed schedule.

As far as getting there, Midland is valid, SD may be somewhat valid but Bloomington, In (Indy), Moline, IL (local or O'Hare) and Bloomington, IL (local or O'Hare) are not bad options at all. I know the last time Moline hosted, many teams used Chicago airports. I was at Navy Pier and quite a few teams were there and visiting Chicago. They seemed to be having a good time.

As far as Premier, they'll get the majority of the top CA teams and some top teams around the rest of the nation. Otherwise at only 64 teams/age group, that's really chump change nationally. It won't make a dent in the number of teams that want to attend ASA Nationals, it will just pull some of the top teams away is all.

Bottom line:

Premier isn't for everyone
ASA isn't for everyone
USFA isn't for everyone
UTrip isn't for everyone
Triple Crown isn't for everyone
ABC easy as 1-2-3 isn't for everyone.

 

[Atlantabell]

Agreed. But, when I make a choice and get verbally beaten up and "threatened" by my ASA State director that I will somehow be on his sh^^ list because I decide to go elsewhere, that is a concern. Or when someone lies to me about things, that is a concern. I may want to go to ASA Nationals next year, who knows? I just know that organizations have to change with the times or they end up being irrelevant.

I am someone who spent approximately 15 years as the officer of a national sports governing body. I know that, as difficult as it may be, you HAVE to listen and try to address member's concerns. They are the people keeping you going. You can't address ALL of them, but you should at least listen. At the local ASA level, I don't get that feeling. I get "blown off" all the time.

 

[JAD]

As far as Premier, they'll get the majority of the top CA teams and some top teams around the rest of the nation. Otherwise at only 64 teams/age group, that's really chump change nationally. It won't make a dent in the number of teams that want to attend ASA Nationals, it will just pull some of the top teams away.one.

For me, the draw of ASA Nationals has always been to play against the best competition in the country. If the top 64 teams in the country go to Premier then what is the compelling reason to go to South Dakota? I would rather just go to Panama City Beach and play USFA! Will the winner of ASA Nationals be declared the 65th best team in the country? LOL

 

[TheRogue]

I'm sure if it ever rained in Midland, TX it would be a great place. Last year, the fields were in poor condition because of drought...we were told the city refused to turn the water on until a week before, which basically meant nothing. Dirty, windy....that's normal conditions there. Why even deal with that when there are so many beautiful facilities in cost effective venues across the country?

It's 3 hours from Chicago to Moline.