Players Cleaning Gym After Loss--High School Varsity

[CoogansBluff]

This is one of those rare times when I must strongly disagree with CoogansBluff.

The team used the gym. It's unreasonable to suggest that they should never take part in cleaning it. My daughter often helps when I'm cleaning up our local park, even on days when she doesn't play or practice. There are a small handful of girls who also help keep the park clean. The majority of players and their parents, however, do not. It's someone else's job.

Not everything that happens related to sports is about excelling in sports. Whether you want to admit it or not, there can be great value in stepping into the shoes of another. If you don't believe that children can benefit from doing so, then maybe a reconsideration of who has the low opinion of them is in order.

I don't think we disagree, at least not strongly.

If they were cleaning the gym because it needed cleaning, then it's very reasonable that they help clean it, as you said. It's like getting players involved in taking care of the softball field. It teaches responsibility and appreciation. Just not sure how it is helpful to use it as punishment. My daughter has chores, but they aren't punishment.

We don't know the coach's intent in this case, so I again need to state that my opinions are about shame and punishment in general and not the incident that started the discussion. What this coach did might've been appropriate. I don't know the context or the relationship he has with his players.

 

[GOINGDEEP]

My daughter has chores, but they aren't punishment.

Mine has chores too. But if she disrespects, misses a curfew, scores bad or lower on a test than she should, gives less than ordinary effort on a wide variety of things................she will do more chores as a form of punishment.

I don't see the shame in this case. Didn't the OP say they sat on the bench until everyone had left, and then cleaned the floors? If they were forced to clean in front of a packed gym at halftime, I might agree that was intentional shame.

 

[Coletrain]

I would not have a problem with it! My DD is OCD, so she would love it!

 

[Hyper Henry]

This past season we played a game where at least half of our girls completely gave up. Only down by 5 or 6 runs but these girls just quit on me no matter what I tried to say. Even throwing the ball around in between innings was effortless with goofing around as well. After the game I told them to leave their cleats on and meet me in the field behind the diamond. We...yes we, I ran with them for 15 min. straight with wind sprints in-between. I had some girls trying to beat me in the wind sprints but I also had a couple in tears because they are not strong runners. We had a team meeting afterwards and I just told them "see how much energy you guys had running just now, you wasted all that energy you could have been using on the ball diamond". The good part was some of the girls really got it and were heard saying "I will never quit in a game again!"!! The bad part was I was confronted by 3 parents yelling at me saying "I embarrassed and humiliated their daughters". Actually think one dad was ready to take a swing at me he was so worked up!
Anyway I stand by my decision but no way no how will everyone agree!
BTW........you folks in the US sure are lucky in being able get away with more when it comes to dicipline and working the girls hard...lol

 

[GOINGDEEP]

I think a coach running with them is great. If you're doing the running too, parents have no right to say crap. I know lots have problems with punishment in sports, but as long as its not a weekly thing and done for a purpose with positive results..............many times it will motivate. I think most parents who make a fuss never played sports or only played at levels where it's main purpose was just fun and socialization. Nothing wrong with that at all, just competitors need a push now and then.

Running a tad extra doesn't hurt those kids. I only wish I could run like I did in those days now.

 

[Cannonball]

One of my very close friends just won his 500th game at the school he is presently at. He has another 200 wins at another school. In his remarks in the newspaper, he commented that in all of that time, he had never made a basket or had an assist. He if very humble but everyone in the area knows how important he is to his kids and program. I was his assistant for several years. After one particularly tough loss, we were planning the next practice. Coach stopped and asked what was there in his practice plan that was about getting better. IOWs, we were planning on getting after them and, to be honest, they needed more basketball skills. So, instead of punishment, we went back to our first week's practices where all we did was essential fundamentals. We also decided that from that day forward, we would not run suicides etc. with our players. Instead, all running would be accomplished with a basketball. His practices are great to watch and I incorporated those same principles when I became a head coach in basketball.

Now, what does cleaning a gym have to do with making his team better? If a coach can answer that with substance then more power to him/her. If not, it is wasted energy that could have been directed at better skills development. Finally, IMO, a coach has as much responsibility in a loss as any player. Is the coach punishing himself/herself? How many quick hitters for a basket does the team have? Can they press a couple of different ways? I liked running and jumping full court man but had a basic 1-2-2 Zone we used once in a while. Does he have in bounding the ball plays for every scenerio? Meaning, specific for time on the clock? How can they "hold the ball?" I like 4-Corners but also run a stack/spread offense to take time off of the clock. Every coach has a lot of room for improvement and I say that because I've been fortunate enough to sit and talk to some of the best in the country and they always are looking for that one play that will get them points or that one gimmic defense that they can run for a stop or two in a close game.

I guess I'm saying I'm not hip to the punishment!

 

[CycloneSoftball22]

Well , I played for a coach in HS that has over 900 wins and has one 5 state championships and 5 runner ups. He actually took over the softball program at one point and won a state title in his second year. He used running as punishment all the time. He also had the "my way or the highway" mentality. Any interference from the parents was not allowed in any shape or form. We hated him , but we respected what he knew about the game and his results spoke for themselves. So , we had two choices - get with the program or get out. I am really glad I stayed.

 

[Cannonball]

Well , I played for a coach in HS that has over 900 wins and has one 5 state championships and 5 runner ups. He actually took over the softball program at one point and won a state title in his second year. He used running as punishment all the time. He also had the "my way or the highway" mentality. Any interference from the parents was not allowed in any shape or form. We hated him , but we respected what he knew about the game and his results spoke for themselves. So , we had two choices - get with the program or get out. I am really glad I stayed.

Which state? I'm fascinated and want to read about the program.

 

[Amy in AZ.]

Cannonball, I don't know where Cyclone is from. The first program that came to my mind is Dave Greer and Pleasant Plains, IL. No one complains as long as he is winning state championships.

 

[Cannonball]

Amy, everyone in our state knows about Coach Greer. Yup, he's has had year upon year of success. I coached in a pretty good program myself. We won 2 state titles, a state runner up, once won 64 games in a row, another team went 40-0, and some of those teams were the mythical national champs. I'm always fascinated by successful coaches and what they do.