- Feb 17, 2011
- 201
- 16
the only pitch she really bends her rear knee even a little is a riseball
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crowhopping?
- Thread starter dbias
- Start date
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the only pitch she really bends her rear knee even a little is a riseball
First, if her foot never leaves the ground, how can she RE plant? Second, why would an umpire say anything in front of other coaches? Third, Did you solicit his opinion? This is clearly an example of a bad umpire. I hope you just did the head nod and moved on. I actually had an umpire tell me once that my pitcher was illegal. He couldn't tell me why. His explanation was that she would be legal in college, just not high school. I calmly explained to him that should he call her for illegal pitch, he would probably need a better reason than that. It amazes me sometimes that the only people getting paid on the field are sometimes the most ignorant.
- Jul 28, 2008
- 1,084
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Ahhh, like this past weekend when they called my 12U pitcher on an IP for going to the mouth to get some grip, and not wiping it off with runners on 2nd and 3rd?
The ASA rules do not talk about "crow- hopping" except to include it's definition. They are clear about the fact that it is the act of replanting that is illegal- and that is replanting after a leap-that produces the obvious hop- OR replanting after dragging (more subtle but still easy to spot). The latter occurs most commonly (at least IMO) with pitchers who drag on the side of their foot rather than the toe. They drag on the side, then turn the foot- sole down- and push off to give themselves additional leverage. They often lean forward on release. This "push off" occurs before the release of the ball. The poster should video their daughter- and watch the foot as it drags- if it does not turn sole down- it is not illegal.
That being said, there are umpires who are not clear about the definition- (it is good to have the rule book). However, if you believe a pitcher that drags cannot replant, you are incorrect
That being said, there are umpires who are not clear about the definition- (it is good to have the rule book). However, if you believe a pitcher that drags cannot replant, you are incorrect
- Jul 28, 2008
- 1,084
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You do not have to leave the ground to establish a new push-off point. You can push, drag, push and it's a crow-hop. Word for word from the ASA rulebook...
CROW HOP: (Fast Pitch) Defined as the act of a pitcher who steps, hops or drags
off the front of the pitcher’s plate, replants the pivot foot, thereby establishing a
second impetus (or starting point), pushes off from the newly established starting
point and completes the delivery.
- Feb 17, 2011
- 201
- 16
i understand the replant as establishing a second impetus... but as i said before.... she starts the drag on her toe but as the hips close after the ball passes the hip the right heel rotates down to contact the ground and pushes a wave of dirt/sand that comes up onto the heel of the plant foot. I assume the wave of sand being pulled toward home plate shows to me anyway that she is not slowing the drag to push off again. As for talking about the situation in front of the other coaches, we are all friends and have coached with and against each other for years, heck we know each other so well we dont even bother to try to steal signs. lol The most competitve we get is on the golf course when we find time... beer a hole.
Here's a general question to everyone. Can a pivot foot that is in motion and dragging along the ground, create a "replant" and second impetus or starting point?
- Jul 28, 2008
- 1,084
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Yes. We have a pitcher in our organization who does it. She's been called for it, too. I'll try to get a video of it.
halskinner
Banned
- May 7, 2008
- 2,637
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Who says it has to ve dragging behing to replant? What if the stride foot first pushes the body and the pivot foot forward, then the pivot foot pushes off a foot in front of the rubber, the stride foot then comes forward of the picot foot and the ball is released.
The absolute king of the crow hoppers necer ever got called for it. He would present the ball, freeze and his feet appeared to just mahically glide forward ahead of the rubber and then he started the pitch. YOU AND THE BLUES COULD NOT SEE HIS FEET DOING ANYTHING AT ALL. He pushed with his stride foot, touched down with his piot foot 1 to 2 feet ahead of the rubber and then he threw the pitch.
He went on to pitch for the USA Men's nationalteam and won the Pan Am games also.
I played with him and against him for several years. First name was Pete.
On Monday after the first inning had an ump walk over to our dugout. conversation went like this
Ump. the other team has a video from the first inning and they say your pitcher is crow hopping.
Me. Scott that girl has never crow hopped in her life. did you or your partner see her crow hopping
ump. no but they say its on tape
Me. did you see the tape
Ump, yes
Me. Is video review allowed in our rules
Ump. no
me. was she crow hopping in the video
Ump, no
me. then why are we talking about it
ump. because they say they have it on video so just tell your pitcher to be careful.
me. I'm not telling her a thing. If you see her crow hop, call it, we will deal with it then.
Ump. the other team has a video from the first inning and they say your pitcher is crow hopping.
Me. Scott that girl has never crow hopped in her life. did you or your partner see her crow hopping
ump. no but they say its on tape
Me. did you see the tape
Ump, yes
Me. Is video review allowed in our rules
Ump. no
me. was she crow hopping in the video
Ump, no
me. then why are we talking about it
ump. because they say they have it on video so just tell your pitcher to be careful.
me. I'm not telling her a thing. If you see her crow hop, call it, we will deal with it then.
