Closing the Door: Squaring Hips/Shoulders to Catcher?

[redhawkridge]

Been watching the Super Regionals NCAA games, and many of the pitchers are closing their hips -- in fact several aren't opening the body to any great degree. Their arm and shoulder crank around to achieve the windmill but their body maintains a largely closed stance. In fact, I noticed a tendency of the stride foot to land significantly to the left of the power line with the foot pointing straight ahead. And a lot of falling off to the pitching hand side in the finish, due I suppose to the exertion.
So, what am I to think, since all of the above is in conflict with the fundamentals I preach to my pitching student. Well, I guess when a pitcher reaches the heights of top shelf collegiate programs, they are modifying to what works for their own abilities. But I ain't changing my principles, because I believe in them, and, at the beginner/intermediate/highschool level, the girls can only benefit from the most mechanically sound techniques.
jim

 

[Ken Krause]

Isn't that taught mainly to beginning pitchers that are pretty young?

Both my DD's coaches teach the close, but the one has already told her that she'll adjust her style and mechanics as she gets older. For now, though, she's instructed to do it this way and it works. When she closes, she's close to 80% strikes, but when she doesn't, the number drops to the 40-50% range.

Not knowing jack about the sport, I'm willing to accept this as a reliable method of instruction based solely on the results. Knowing how independently-minded my kid is, though, I'm quite certain she'll have her very own pitch by the time she's 14. hehe

I disagree with that premise. Why learning something one way, then have to completely change it later after the first set of habits is ingrained. It sounds like a quick fix to avoid having to work to achieve success.

In my opinion your daughter should be learning good, long-term mechanics now. They will help her build speed, build accuracy, and save her shoulder down the road. Pitching squared up to the plate (never opening) will cause shoulder impingement, which is not only painful but could keep her from pitching later on.

Keep in mind that accuracy is not a goal, it's a result. If she does the right things the right way she will be accurate. I'd ask her pitching coach to teach her the right way to pitch now. If he/she won't, find someone else or you'll be wasting her time and your money.

 

[Ken Krause]

Been watching the Super Regionals NCAA games, and many of the pitchers are closing their hips -- in fact several aren't opening the body to any great degree. Their arm and shoulder crank around to achieve the windmill but their body maintains a largely closed stance. In fact, I noticed a tendency of the stride foot to land significantly to the left of the power line with the foot pointing straight ahead. And a lot of falling off to the pitching hand side in the finish, due I suppose to the exertion.
So, what am I to think, since all of the above is in conflict with the fundamentals I preach to my pitching student. Well, I guess when a pitcher reaches the heights of top shelf collegiate programs, they are modifying to what works for their own abilities. But I ain't changing my principles, because I believe in them, and, at the beginner/intermediate/highschool level, the girls can only benefit from the most mechanically sound techniques.
jim

I wouldn't pitch that way (if I were a pitcher, which I am not) and I wouldn't teach it no matter how successful they may be right now. There have been some studies on shoulder injuries on softball pitchers lately and I'd bet this is a big part of it. My guess is those pitchers would be every bit as successful as they are now, and more, with better mechanics.

 

[3DD'sDAD]

Sorry, haven't been back in a bit, DD is busy with two teams (including ours) and being the designated driver, i haven't had much time. The pitcher I referred to earlier is not my daughter and can't get permission to post video. This weekend, our first tournament, she went down with a knee injury - her push off (trying to avoid pivot foot here) foot or right leg knee. Nothing serious but enough to keep her from pitching and my DD on the hill. Too much torque being created by her pivot. Will be working on it more this week. The ball drill (I will probably use a tennis ball) sounds like a good idea. I will definitely try it and report back. Thanks for the input.

 

[Old Man River]

I would suggest that what is now called the new or modern style is what Men's Fastpitch ( and also most of the better women pitchers in that era ) did for years back in the 60's and 70's- so that when I started coaching young girl"s how to pitch starting in the 80's, I was accused of teaching them" to pitch like a man". This concept of emphasizing the " closing " still plagues the majority of coaches today and I would call this " closing emphasis " more an aberration invented by sincere but ignorant coaches who had never experienced the genuine; but thankfully for a number of years now, people are finally taking notice of what most of the best are doing!

 

[stephanie]

all I know is that when my DD does her K-drills, she can do a kazillion of them, no problem. I can't imaging her doing those with her hips and shoulders facing the catcher....(what the heck would they be called then?) And it just seems that it would really hurt her shoulder after 20 or so...

 

[Bruce_W]

all I know is that when my DD does her K-drills, she can do a kazillion of them, no problem. I can't imaging her doing those with her hips and shoulders facing the catcher....(what the heck would they be called then?) And it just seems that it would really hurt her shoulder after 20 or so...

I would like to see a video clip of this "K" drill being done properly. Anyone?

 

[redhawkridge]

Rick Pauly's video that features his daughter Sarah includes very good video of her working the k drill.
jim

 

[Ken B]

I thought the same about the WCWS pitchers closing, but did some slo-mo with the DVR and found that most seem to be releasing at about halfway open/closed, and follow though naturally with the body. Works best during those few times they show them from the side.

 

[lionelxxl]

Hi, i'm new but i was just watching the wcws between arizona and tenn 2 days back and cheri kempf just mentioned off the top of her head that pitchers should aim for a 45-52 degree hip angle

hope it helps