Drive Mechanics

[Doug Romrell]

Lastly, should your goal be 90? IMO, no. I like 70ish… because I know the effect that the upper torso and arm momentum have on adding to the torso angle. Setting 90 with the feet… results in 90+ overhead…

Javasource...

So, would it be correct to say that, generally speaking, the more a pitcher turns her drive foot (the more toward 45 degrees she goes), the less angle (the more toward 0 degrees)she should have with her stide foot when it lands???

 

[starsnuffer]

Great post, again, JS.

I like the open attitude towards stride foot angle. If anyone has ever had to coach a kid who is bow legged or pigeon toed, it can be a real challenge in getting the right mechanics to happen in ways that do not put undue stress on their joints (pigeon toed especially). As these kids mature and go through puberty, the natural angle of their foot changes, and it is important to recognize these changes and to correct mechanics as they occur. A pigeon toed kid is going to have undue stress on their ACL if they try to land with a 45 degree angle of their foot, but might be fine at 60 degrees, for instance. Osterman and Abbot are both slightly pigeon toed, if you observe them in non-athletic settings.

-W

 

[javasource]

I still see benefit for beginning pitchers.
Giving them a reference to shoot for in the early stages seems like it will help the process along.
Like training wheels on a bike, eventually you remove them.

What's differennt is that you don't need to go all OCD about the plant and/or drive foot angles, as long as it's withing the accepted range.
So put the tape on the floor as a "suggestion" and only correct if the deviation becomes too great?

Although I can envision a PC fixating temproarily upon a more specific angle when trying to correct something else in the DD mechanics that these angles do influence.

Absolutely, Corlay. I still use taped angles... but the angles are specific to each pitcher. I'll use stride and drive orientations for tape... but only as the specific pitcher requires... and I'll often have them move an angle at home around in static drills to help them achieve a good body position.

The tape references are very handy... just not advocating one angle for all.

Also, stride orientation changes hip orientation... As such, I find that slight adjustments to stride orientation... once a pitcher develops comfort and consistency... can help them with location placement... much more than stride angle. In other words, rather than have them stride a little to the left or right, changing the angle of the foot (slight) can help some with inside/outside placement. As such... many of them will benefit from taped lines for a much longer period than just beginners.

Lawrie is a pitcher that I would guess utilizes this method, as her stride orientation (and body lean) vary quite a bit.

 

[JJsqueeze]

I like the chutzpah in taking on the 45 degree thing.

For my part, I have been treating the 45 as an "ish" with a margin of error of about 30%. What I am really looking for is not mostly 0 and not mostly 90. I use 45 only because it is the middle ground between the two so if the girls are targeting this, they are at least angled somewhat.

 

[javasource]

Great post!! I have a question Rick does the push come from the front leg or the back leg?

Okay... gonna edit this... now that my brain is attached...

Simply put, you push out and off the plate with the throwing side foot/leg.

 

[Rocketech1]

Push comes from the back leg... sometimes called the drive leg or the pivot foot. Simply put, you push out and off with the throwing side foot/leg.

In all due respect the back leg is the stride leg (for a right handed pitcher its the left leg) the pivot foot is the front leg (right leg). IMO, you use both legs to push off from the pitching plate. Do sprinters only use only one leg to drive out of the starters box? Both are used, back leg first than immediately the front leg to complete the push off.

 

[CoachScott]

All this said… I often limit drive foot turn-out. Turning the drive foot out much more than 45-degrees (I prefer only what is necessary) is counter-productive… similar to stretching a muscle too far… you’ll negate the directional force if you take it too far… and put the quads at a disadvantage.
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Lastly, should your goal be 90? IMO, no. I like 70ish… because I know the effect that the upper torso and arm momentum have on adding to the torso angle. Setting 90 with the feet… results in 90+ overhead…

Did you just contradict yourself? I'm no expert here and I don't pretend to be one. But it seems like you just said 2 different angles here. No disrespect meant, just want a better understanding.

I always thought the push/drive came off the rubber straight towards catcher. Let me explain a little more in detail. Both feet on rubber facing catcher, upper body going forward to get good sprinter position, drive heel comes up straight as stride foot moves forward, (looking only a drive foot now) drive foot starts to angle to where the heel comes up and the drive foot starts to angle from 0 to slightly over 90 degrees as the big toes drags, I hope I explained that well. I envision the drive foot going from 0 degrees, facing catcher, to slightly over 90 degrees, dragging outside portion of the big toe. I may have to video myself here but that's pretty much how it looks/feels when leaping and dragging. (I really need to get a good camera, trying to convince DW is really hard though)

My stride foot does land ~45 degrees.

I love these post. Keep them coming.

 

[starsnuffer]

Watch the kid sprint 25 meters. If they don't know how to sprint, get them to a running coach or attempt to teach them yourself. That's first.

Second, when they do know how to sprint, record them, and look at the angle of their feet when they are sprinting. Every kid is different. What you want is to replicate that angle for their drive foot, more or less.

Third, the point of controlling the drive/pivot foot angle is two-fold. You want to maximize drive, obviously, but you also want to ensure that the hips do not rotate open early. To maximize drive the pitcher has to maximize the extension of their drive leg using the primary drivers, and that means keeping the hips as square towards the catcher as possible until maximum extension is achieved. At this point the shoulders have already begun to rotate open, thus the hips and shoulders are at different angles which underlies the importance of core strength, because this isn't going to happen properly without it. This also creates stretch across the torso that will help to slingshot the hip open once full leg extension is achieved. The hips and shoulders then realign during this weightless period before again disassociating just before stride foot plant.

Whatever the pivot foot has to do to make that happen for each individual pitcher is what is important. For most kids, that is going to be using the angle that they use best when they're sprinting.

-W

 

[javasource]

Javasource...

So, would it be correct to say that, generally speaking, the more a pitcher turns her drive foot (the more toward 45 degrees she goes), the less angle (the more toward 0 degrees)she should have with her stide foot when it lands???

That would be a generalized statement... it all depends on the pitcher. Take "M" for example... the orientation of her Drive foot is nearly straight forward throughout the pitch... I'd get her so that her thigh externally rotates a little, so that it can adduct and internally rotate... by adjusting how she uses her drive foot a bit...

Then... based on that adjustment... you might tweak the stride orientation... all based on the results of the former... just little adjustments...

 

[javasource]

In all due respect the back leg is the stride leg (for a right handed pitcher its the left leg) the pivot foot is the front leg (right leg). IMO, you use both legs to push off from the pitching plate. Do sprinters only use only one leg to drive out of the starters box? Both are used, back leg first than immediately the front leg to complete the push off.

Yeah... I was a little disoriented... huh? Hopefully the pitching side reference helped. This is why I shouldn't use mobile devices to respond... lol

Good point regarding the push off... The back foot will do a little dig... so I get what you're saying, Rocket... but too much emphasis on a two-legged approach to drive will result in loss of forward momentum and improper weight transfer.

Thanks for keeping me in line!