You're Setting Up for a Ball

[SoCal_Dad]

Was the opposing team having the same problem? If so, feedback from both sides to the umpire's assigner/supervisor may get some corrective action.

We had similar issues with an umpire we got frequently not calling the front corners. Sometimes we could get him to call them. Later on, we used it to our advantage by calling curves inside and screwballs outside (i.e. on a RHB) while our opponents struggled with his strike zone.

 

[MTR]

Last night, we had a situation I've never encountered and I've coached a long time. The umpire told our catcher that she was setting up for a ball and he was not going to give her a call until she stopped. Pitcher has a very good curve and better than average screwball. She is a "horizontal" pitcher which can be troubling if she misses her spots. Regardless of where the pitch was, he called it a ball until she set up with her mitt behind the white of the plate. When asked about this, the reply was, "I do college games." No matter how many times the umpire was asked if the pitch was catching the plate, he replies in one of two ways. Either "I do college games," or, your catcher's setting up for a ball. I know that the umpires on this site would at least have a decent discussion with a coach over this. I made the comment last night after it was suggested I was going to get tossed, and believe me, I was never loud or disrespectful, I never yelled from the dugout, that I would not get tossed from a game. I felt so angry but left it alone.

If you can get the umpire to confirm the highlighted comment, you have a potential to protest the game. What determines a strike is clearly defined and I do not recall any associations requiring a catcher to set up anywhere by in the catcher's box which extends 42" off the white of the plate. It is not judgment, it is a misapplication of a rule since his call is predetermined prior to the pitch.

 

[marriard]

If you can get the umpire to confirm the highlighted comment, you have a potential to protest the game. What determines a strike is clearly defined and I do not recall any associations requiring a catcher to set up anywhere by in the catcher's box which extends 42" off the white of the plate. It is not judgment, it is a misapplication of a rule since his call is predetermined prior to the pitch.

One good thing about High School ball is there is normally a defined way of providing feedback to the appropriate party. Up to you to determine if it is worth it.

Predetermining that you are not calling a strike based on ANYTHING is unacceptable. Telling anyone why you are doing it is just stupid.

 

[Cannonball]

If you can get the umpire to confirm the highlighted comment, you have a potential to protest the game. What determines a strike is clearly defined and I do not recall any associations requiring a catcher to set up anywhere by in the catcher's box which extends 42" off the white of the plate. It is not judgment, it is a misapplication of a rule since his call is predetermined prior to the pitch.

MTR, we won and again, I just wanted to be able to discuss this. What level anyone umpires does not put them above a decent discussion. I as pro umpire as anyone you will ever see. I am going to check our local college games to see if I can find his name. In all the time I watched my dd play, I never saw him. I do appreciate your observations on Umpiring. We are lucky to have you and a few others here to help us out.

Marriard, I agree on telling anyone what he will call is stupid but equally as stupid/uncalled for was to threaten to throw me out.

 

[Josh Greer]

I guess if my pitcher had that kind of hook, and Blue is going to call it where it lands, I'd tell her to pitch out of the zone and make sure it lands in the mitt. His dumb rule; make him abide by it.

But I get that that's not the context of your thread. Sounds like you did the right thing, though (not sure I would have). I'm not sure I'd let it go though, either. Perhaps bounce it off the UIC if available. If for no other reason than to address the sharp nature of his response. Sounds like he will instigate some coach who might show less restraint. And that won't be good for the girls either.

 

[chinamigarden]

Like the ump who told the catcher, if you were framing those better I would call them strikes. They are hitting the corner but you aren't making them look good enough.

My dd was the pitcher that game.

 

[Cannonball]

Like the ump who told the catcher, if you were framing those better I would call them strikes. They are hitting the corner but you aren't making them look good enough.

My dd was the pitcher that game.

That is crazy!

Josh, I had a talk with the girls before the game about the old style coach I was and that I don't want to ever be that guy again. Not that it was bad but these girls are not ready for that type of coach. So, here I was in the game knowing that I could not allow myself to get to that edge with the Umpire. I didn't want to ruin their season or scare them. I think a part of the nature of having exceptional Umpires is that they are so confident in their abilities that they will discuss almost anything with a coach given that the coach has acted with respect. I don't understand this last game. Hey, thanks everyone for letting me vent some.

 

[4 girl's dad]

. Hey, thanks everyone for letting me vent some.

That's what I love about this forum. Thanks for sharing!

 

[PlayPerfect]

The best time to chat with an ump is before a game. Mid game, do it between innings and if you must then, make sure the parents think it is just a jovial conversation. During my summer camps, I bring in an umpire for a daily session. They advise the catchers to speak to the ump with their back turned to them and their mask on so no one else knows they are chatting. And the catcher should always ask if they are setting up ok and not blocking their view. They should do that in the first inning. It creates an atmosphere of comraderie. COACHS - teach ur catchers how to interact with the plate ump. They are spending two hours of their day together. Never let your kid over frame a pitch for 2 seconds...half a second max and move on. Ive coached 45 seasons the last 15 years in hoops and softball....I don't think Ive ever seen an ump or ref give anyone call because the coach worked them over or called them out. Not once. To the contrary, you will be officiated against. My advice to umps and coaches is this....its a youth experience. Bury your egos in your pocket and don't let anyone see them. Give the kids and parents a good time and you will never dwell on the wins and losses.

 

[3afan]

When I umpire I don't miss too many pitches that are strikes, we all know that the strike zone is where it crosses the plate not where the catcher catches the pitch. However, I will say as an umpire there are times a catcher can make it hard to call a pitch a strike. And I do know umpires that are more worried about perception and to be honest it is a real thing and a concern at times. What I mean is if it looks like a strike it's easier for me to call it a strike. If your catcher is setting up 6" outside and never moves her mitt perception is that pitch was 6" outside. If she has her mitt under the ball and holds it up on a low strike it's a lot easier to call it a strike than if she pushes her mitt to the ground as she catches it. If she drags it over 4-5" moving her entire arm as she catches it on the outside corner vs rolling the mitt with only a little wrist movement. Lastly if she sets up on the inside corner and the pitch breaks to the outside corner and she has to almost dive to catch the ball it looks real bad when you call that a strike. Now I have called all of these strikes in games before because they have crossed the plate prior to reaching the catcher, but I have also taken some grief for doing so. And I do see that the higher the level the more this perception impacts some umpires. Again is it right? NO call the zone no matter where it gets caught! But there is a thing called believability and it appears this umpire has taken that to a whole nother level!!

good and accurate description --- some catchers DO make the umps job harder!