USA, USA, USA!!! The ASA rebrand...

[riseball]

...To assume that college coaches are coming here to merely "vacation" smacks of condescension....

Who stated that? I must have missed that post, or perhaps you are tossing out a strawman?

I am sure that there are plenty of college coaches looking at players already on their radar or committed to their schools. However, there are also many teams and parents that are buying into the come play against the best and get discovered fantasy. I am sure that PGF is not a bit player in SoCal or even the left coast, especially when you are already there. But the reality is that softball is a national sport and in the grand scheme of things PGF is a relatively small part. It is a once a year All Star tournament at a sunny, warm weather location. As I said in a previous post it is like comparing a Lamborghini to a Toyota.

More than anything PGF is a destination event. If like ASA if it was held in corn field in the mid-west, who would bother? In any double elimination event 25% of the teams go home after only 2 games. For those and the ones that follow, surfing or hanging out in LA beats cow tipping.

 

[Eric F]

By comparison, USSSA Western World Series is the last week of July. Cue the crickets. Besides, USSSA in SoCal is the "participation trophy" of tournaments, a place to end the season after failing to qualify for PGF, ASA or TCS.

Although I'm looking at it through a 12U lens, I can't disagree with any of this. For a number of reasons, our only option was to play U-Trip (even though we qualified for ASA), and the competition level was SIGNIFICANTLY below what we saw two weeks earlier at TCS World Series in San Diego. The reality is that teams are largely ignoring ASA in favor of TCS events throughout the year, and PGF is considered the pinnacle tournament. As I mentioned earlier, in 2015 there were 40+ teams at 12U ASA A-States. This year, less than 20 teams participated, and of the 15 teams that qualified to go to Nats, one went. One. Sure the travel to VA is part of that for a lot of teams, but the other part is that there is much more prestige in qualifying for PGF. ASA A-Regionals gives teams a second chance to qualify for Nats. The few teams that initially registered all pulled out. In travel ball, ASA is almost non-existent, and I don't see that the trend is going to change in the near future.

 

[marriard]

Although I'm looking at it through a 12U lens, I can't disagree with any of this. For a number of reasons, our only option was to play U-Trip (even though we qualified for ASA), and the competition level was SIGNIFICANTLY below what we saw two weeks earlier at TCS World Series in San Diego. The reality is that teams are largely ignoring ASA in favor of TCS events throughout the year, and PGF is considered the pinnacle tournament. As I mentioned earlier, in 2015 there were 40+ teams at 12U ASA A-States. This year, less than 20 teams participated, and of the 15 teams that qualified to go to Nats, one went. One. Sure the travel to VA is part of that for a lot of teams, but the other part is that there is much more prestige in qualifying for PGF. ASA A-Regionals gives teams a second chance to qualify for Nats. The few teams that initially registered all pulled out. In travel ball, ASA is almost non-existent, and I don't see that the trend is going to change in the near future.

As I said - U-Trip is not ready to go all out in California. That they even have a low level foothold is good for them. It is how they have started out elsewhere and they will slowly build. It will take longer in California, but over time there will be more and more U-trip tournaments and at some stage the numbers game goes over to them. Because there is logically way more entry/C/B teams and participants than there is A/Premier teams. They have time... and they have the resources elsewhere to play the long game.

On top of that, California is very much like Florida for softball - you don't have to leave to find the competition. There is plenty locally and the areas that don't have the same level of competition come to you. It is a pretty awesome advantage. We often travel just because we feel like seeing some new teams - not because we have to. But it also means we can be a little isolated from what is going on elsewhere.

Yes, U-Trip is huge here in Florida and more and more regions.

PGF is relevant for exactly what they are - looks like fun. But you can see the difficulties they are having trying to expand beyond it. I don't think they currently have the resources to compete on a week-to-week national basis with U-Trip or even if they want to. And that is OK. I hope one day a PGF Nationals is in our future - but it is going to have to be one hell of a team we bring to make it worth going that far. Love to be on a team that we are confident is good enough to bring that far to compete with the very best.

 

[SoCal_Dad]

Who stated that? I must have missed that post, or perhaps you are tossing out a strawman?

Seriously? Your post suggested they're basically vacationing here. smh

People like to crow about "All of the college coaches" that attend PGF or some other national event. And this matters because? It is not much more than propaganda by the associations and especially the TB coaches to get families to pony up the bucks for a trip to the West coast. Sure college coaches attend PGF. Unfortunately for most coaches even SoCal is a better place to spend a summer weekend over where they coach. Especially if the school is picking up the tab. I suspect that if the AD's ever started asking what they actually accomplished during those trips for many college coaches it would be game over.

FTR, U-Trip resembles Scion out here, not Toyota.

 

[riseball]

Like I said, if it was in the mid-west in a corn field who would bother?

FTR - Scion is made by Toyota.

 

[slugger3]

Who stated that? I must have missed that post, or perhaps you are tossing out a strawman?

I am sure that there are plenty of college coaches looking at players already on their radar or committed to their schools. However, there are also many teams and parents that are buying into the come play against the best and get discovered fantasy. I am sure that PGF is not a bit player in SoCal or even the left coast, especially when you are already there. But the reality is that softball is a national sport and in the grand scheme of things PGF is a relatively small part. It is a once a year All Star tournament at a sunny, warm weather location. As I said in a previous post it is like comparing a Lamborghini to a Toyota.

More than anything PGF is a destination event. If like ASA if it was held in corn field in the mid-west, who would bother? In any double elimination event 25% of the teams go home after only 2 games. For those and the ones that follow, surfing or hanging out in LA beats cow tipping.

What's wrong with Midwest cornfields?...Build it and they will come...ok, maybe only a few.

No way does surfing or hanging out in LA beat cow tipping!!

Only watching bugs getting smoked in a bug zapper beats cow tipping...ok, and maybe 8 second street cars does too.....(queue...Motley Crue's "Kick Start My Heart...")

 

[Mangler II]

With PGF nationals, if you go 0-2 in bracket play, you have 3-4 days to enjoy the sites and all that there is in the LA area. With ASA, you may be in some po dunk town that is a bore. Sure, it's nice to go to different areas of the country, but they tend to pick some very random locations. Normal, IL? Not saying it's bad place, but do you want to be there for 7 days? Salem, OR? Same thing. South Dakota? Findlay, OH? Sure these are all nice places to visit, but spend a week there? Not so sure about that. Just my thoughts.

...should have went to Midland and Montgomery,melted (literally) in Midland and felt VERY unsafe in Montgomery.
Another reason ASA sux

 

[SoCal_Dad]

Like I said, if it was in the mid-west in a corn field who would bother?
We made 2 trips to IL cornfields when ASA/USA Nats were top banana. None after they lost their standing.

FTR - Scion is made by Toyota.

Duh, that's why I said it. If I was going for accuracy, I would've said Yugo.

FTR, the Scion brand is being discontinued this year...

 

[riseball]

I am sure not having to leave your backyard played heavily into that decision. All things equal who would travel? PGF certainly gets a lot of hype for having so few tournaments. To their credit it seems quite a few have drank the koolaid.

 

[SoCal_Dad]

I am sure not having to leave your backyard played heavily into that decision. All things equal who would travel?
Mid'land (i.e. middle-of-nowhere-land) being ASA's BFE location also played heavily into that decision - our team was interested in continuing to play ASA/USA, but Midland was too undesirable. At PGF, Hutch rolled her eyes at the mention of Midland and told us she sent an AC there.

PGF certainly gets a lot of hype for having so few tournaments.
Your obsession with quantity over quality leads me to believe you're a big fan of McDonalds. Prior to PGF, teams aimed for ASA/USA Nats even though ASA only ran 2-3 events here. There has long been several options here and no one dominates. Competition and choice are good things.

To their credit it seems quite a few have drank the koolaid.

PGF's detractors find it a bitter pill to swallow - especially in Florida because they want everyone traveling there. #jealousy

There are various levels in TB and options within each. I've consistently advocated teams first figure out where they stand in the big scheme along with their goals, budget and options before trying to put together a schedule that's appropriate for them. There is no such thing as one-schedule-fits-all-teams - even within a region.