Stretch & Fire Success!

[Steve Huff]

Based off of your just foolishness comment you are getting frustrated.

I never said you advocated to the bat touching the rear shoulder. You did say it gets near the rear shoulder and stays there in a connected swing.

Your next comment where you say they come around in an arc around the shoulders or on a low pitch the waist is truly pure nonsense. You are describing the longest swing possible.

Now it is, when the tip of the bat is committed determines the length of the swing? I am now confused. Are you saying commitment as in your definition of when the tip starts to move?

You didn't respond whether or not the hitter in the clip has a long or short swing based on your definition.

Yes I did, it was right above you. "Very compact".

To the first question. Yes, it stays near the shoulder in a connected swing. Yes visually the hands, pull the bat around the shoulders in a connected arc. The shoulders have width, and pivot above the pelvis, the front hip moves away as the back hip pushed through. So the hands comes around the shoulders in an arc. Though I would term it more linear than an arc to connection. But that is semantics.

The hip rotation doesn't slow down to allow the hands time to catch up. The hands are there! So once heel plant occurs, the hips rotate and the hands are there! At connection! So unless some other activity interferes with a quick swing, such as sweeping, or bat drag, which in this case they are not, then the time of the swing will be determined by the subsequent extension. If, a player uses a lot of coil, a straight front or barred arm, squish the bug, or bat drag, tucks the back elbow, or isn't athletic, then the swing will not be quick. But if the front foot sets down in time, rotation is accomplished efficiently, then the bat is there to deliver. Pujols did it about as simply as you can get in his swing shown above.


[video]http://hittingillustrated.com/images/PujolsIR.gif[/video]

 

[Steve Huff]

OK, good. You commented on the Pujols clip. Please tell me if this is long or short in your eyes. Thanks

I know you guys think I am trying to bash someone here but that is not true.

If a woman tells you that you are incredibly handsome. You feel good until you see her telling someone you find repulsive that he is incredibly handsome.

I am just trying to figure out if you see things the same way that I do and then I can base my opinions on how you see the swing.

Compact! It is about the same as Pujols. But, he holds his hands closer to the shoulder which I don't like. It makes it harder to get your hands inside the ball, out in front of your body. You can see that the hands form a relatively straight line to connection, but then what happens? So the effect is a big arc, and on a hard inside pitch, his arms are pinched, and he will struggle getting the hands through. I like Pujols' hand position better.

 

[HYP]

Compact! It is about the same as Pujols. But, he holds his hands closer to the shoulder which I don't like. It makes it harder to get your hands inside the ball, out in front of your body. You can see that the hands form a relatively straight line to connection, but then what happens? So the effect is a big arc, and on a hard inside pitch, his arms are pinched, and he will struggle getting the hands through. I like Pujols' hand position better.

Thanks, all I needed to know. You think that Pujols and Torres are doing the same thing except the hand position is different. Please correct me if I am wrong.

If I am not wrong then we are on 2 completely different sides of the fence. The only similarities I see is they are using a wood bat.

 

[HYP]

Compact! It is about the same as Pujols. But, he holds his hands closer to the shoulder which I don't like. It makes it harder to get your hands inside the ball, out in front of your body. You can see that the hands form a relatively straight line to connection, but then what happens? So the effect is a big arc, and on a hard inside pitch, his arms are pinched, and he will struggle getting the hands through. I like Pujols' hand position better.

duplicate........

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

Thanks, all I needed to know. You think that Pujols and Torres are doing the same thing except the hand position is different. Please correct me if I am wrong.

If I am not wrong then we are on 2 completely different sides of the fence. The only similarities I see is they are using a wood bat.

Okay, now that literally made me laugh out loud.

 

[Steve Huff]

Thanks, all I needed to know. You think that Pujols and Torres are doing the same thing except the hand position is different. Please correct me if I am wrong.

If I am not wrong then we are on 2 completely different sides of the fence. The only similarities I see is they are using a wood bat.

You asked if they were compact! I addressed that. In that I also addressed the differences in their hand path, but both were direct. However, I can not compare a partial swing from a 90 degree different angle and assess anything else. I don't know his swing except this gif. If he has had success at the major league level, then perhaps you can out do him, or Chris O'Leary. One up him! I can't! I have never worked with a major league hitter. I don't know any. It is kind of like the put up, or shut up scenario. You can talk all you want, which is what the other guys do. Prove it! And then on top of it, you don't show me the differences, between the Pujols gif and this gif to demonstrate the big differences in the length of swing, compact, as you say. Nothing else though. You can't see anything else to be definitive. I can't come back to see your answer, but it would be curious what your limited concept is of "compact"?

 

[HYP]

You asked if they were compact! I addressed that. In that I also addressed the differences in their hand path, but both were direct. However, I can not compare a partial swing from a 90 degree different angle and assess anything else. I don't know his swing except this gif. If he has had success at the major league level, then perhaps you can out do him, or Chris O'Leary. One up him! I can't! I have never worked with a major league hitter. I don't know any. It is kind of like the put up, or shut up scenario. You can talk all you want, which is what the other guys do. Prove it! And then on top of it, you don't show me the differences, between the Pujols gif and this gif to demonstrate the big differences in the length of swing, compact, as you say. Nothing else though. You can't see anything else to be definitive. I can't come back to see your answer, but it would be curious what your limited concept is of "compact"?

Looking at these clips who is the hitter who holds the hinge angle?

Who is the hitter who maintains the connection of the hands to the rear shoulder and drags the bat around?

Which hitter is swinging the bat around the shoulders?

Which hitter is creating a big CHP?

The hitters other then Torres' are using their hands to move the barrel around them. They are moving the barrel around the hands. The barrel gets delivered around the hands which creates a tighter radius. The barrel can then be delivered quicker and more compact. The hands do not have to move as far to get the barrel to the ball. The hands can take a much more direct path and so can the barrel.

Torres is delivering the barrel around his shoulders which increases the radius making a longer swing. It takes longer to deliver the barrel. The hands have to travel farther to get the barrel there. Therefore he has to start the hands and barrel earlier. He has to commit earlier. He is locking on and turning.

What do you consider working with an MLB hitter? Talking to him? Taking credit for his mechanics when things are going good and then blaming his instructors when things go bad? Saying that you do not like bat wrap and then later saying that the reason that your MLB hitter did so well was because he had the bat wrap? The very thing that you said was bad when he was doing so good. Later saying that his instructors took away the bat wrap. The same instructors that "took" away his bat wrap leave Posey alone with his.

So, please give me your definition of working with an MLB guy.

Steve,

I have not attack you once. I have been civil but honestly, I think you are making stuff up as you go. From, wishing she would swing a bat 1 ounce lighter to yelling at her in the middle of her swing. That wasn't sarcasm, you really thought it would fly. I gave you the easy way out.

Now you want to go to the put up or shut up post out there. My clients are my business. I could careless if you believe that I work with anyone or not. I don't care if you believe I work with and have worked with MLB players. It is not about that. It is about the content of what is being said and taught. Your words describe a long connected swing.

At the end of the day, just like Tewks would say, what does it matter. You will either get out and swing and research and figure things out. Then you will learn to teach it. I will too step back and stay away for a while. i will check in from time to time. I have responsibilities as well.

Peace

 

[Steve Huff]

Looking at these clips who is the hitter who holds the hinge angle?

Who is the hitter who maintains the connection of the hands to the rear shoulder and drags the bat around?

Which hitter is swinging the bat around the shoulders?

Which hitter is creating a big CHP?

The hitters other then Torres' are using their hands to move the barrel around them. They are moving the barrel around the hands. The barrel gets delivered around the hands which creates a tighter radius. The barrel can then be delivered quicker and more compact. The hands do not have to move as far to get the barrel to the ball. The hands can take a much more direct path and so can the barrel.

Torres is delivering the barrel around his shoulders which increases the radius making a longer swing. It takes longer to deliver the barrel. The hands have to travel farther to get the barrel there. Therefore he has to start the hands and barrel earlier. He has to commit earlier. He is locking on and turning.

What do you consider working with an MLB hitter? Talking to him? Taking credit for his mechanics when things are going good and then blaming his instructors when things go bad? Saying that you do not like bat wrap and then later saying that the reason that your MLB hitter did so well was because he had the bat wrap? The very thing that you said was bad when he was doing so good. Later saying that his instructors took away the bat wrap. The same instructors that "took" away his bat wrap leave Posey alone with his.

So, please give me your definition of working with an MLB guy.

Steve,

I have not attack you once. I have been civil but honestly, I think you are making stuff up as you go. From, wishing she would swing a bat 1 ounce lighter to yelling at her in the middle of her swing. That wasn't sarcasm, you really thought it would fly. I gave you the easy way out.

Now you want to go to the put up or shut up post out there. My clients are my business. I could careless if you believe that I work with anyone or not. I don't care if you believe I work with and have worked with MLB players. It is not about that. It is about the content of what is being said and taught. Your words describe a long connected swing.

At the end of the day, just like Tewks would say, what does it matter. You will either get out and swing and research and figure things out. Then you will learn to teach it. I will too step back and stay away for a while. i will check in from time to time. I have responsibilities as well.

Peace

This is my last post here. I don't care whether you like it or not. I don't care if you don't like my answers. I don't appreciate your obnoxious remarks, or insinuation that I might have, and now really did say to her, in the middle of her swing which lasted less than .4 seconds. The ball gets there in .42 or less from release. And now I am talking to her in the middle of the pitch? In fact I lied. It was a rise-ball and I told her it was a "change-up, then a curve, then a drop". Of course I stuttered a little too! Happy?

As far as using a bat 1 oz less, perhaps as I said, you need to ask some major leaguers that question. But they have already answered it. Afonso Soriano for one. "Soriano, who has used one of the heaviest bats in the majors much of his career (35oz), went from 33½ ounces to 32 and said it's working out all right. But to go any lighter than that, he said, ''might start to be uncomfortable.""
That is a 4% drop in weight. The drop from 35 to 33.5 was also approx. 4%. Going from 24oz to 23oz is a drop of ................ 4%. And the suggestion to a 33, not 33.5oz bat I suggested on the Cubs forum in 2009. No he didn't read it. So, you are being a jerk here too!

You post videos of two extreme angles ask if they are compact. I said yes, though Albert's is better. All 3 are compact, though I would rate Torres last. They all three are fundamentally different. They are all 3 different speeds. The Pujols and first Cabrera gif can be most closely compared because the pitch is most similar. I can say that Cabrera here, has more bat wrap. But for me that does not make a longer swing. It is the time the hands move from load to contact. If you don't like that definition, too bad!
They also hold their hands away from their shoulder more, which I prefer. The others you can assess, but you can't compare. The one thing and only thing I will say in addition to the hand location issue of Torres is that I don't think his hips are explosive enough. As to what this gif in particular has to do with O'Leary, I don't know. What does he think of it? You can't give me the same angles, and you don't give me the same speed. How would O'Leary change it? I can't answer for him.

I have to be honest with you. I find a lot of you guys offensive. Especially from the northeast, though Teacherman is an exception. It is just politics. I don't believe you when you say you aren't part of the "group". Your tactics are very similar to Marcus. I just honestly don't find you engaging.

 

[RayR]

Honest question since you brought it up: Do you think that barrel path has an affect on how the hips work? Or do you think it is a strength issue?

The one thing and only thing I will say in addition to the hand location issue of Torres is that I don't think his hips are explosive enough.

 

[HYP]

This is my last post here. I don't care whether you like it or not. I don't care if you don't like my answers. I don't appreciate your obnoxious remarks, or insinuation that I might have, and now really did say to her, in the middle of her swing which lasted less than .4 seconds. The ball gets there in .42 or less from release. And now I am talking to her in the middle of the pitch? In fact I lied. It was a rise-ball and I told her it was a "change-up, then a curve, then a drop". Of course I stuttered a little too! Happy?

As far as using a bat 1 oz less, perhaps as I said, you need to ask some major leaguers that question. But they have already answered it. Afonso Soriano for one. "Soriano, who has used one of the heaviest bats in the majors much of his career (35oz), went from 33½ ounces to 32 and said it's working out all right. But to go any lighter than that, he said, ''might start to be uncomfortable.""
That is a 4% drop in weight. The drop from 35 to 33.5 was also approx. 4%. Going from 24oz to 23oz is a drop of ................ 4%. And the suggestion to a 33, not 33.5oz bat I suggested on the Cubs forum in 2009. No he didn't read it. So, you are being a jerk here too!

You post videos of two extreme angles ask if they are compact. I said yes, though Albert's is better. All 3 are compact, though I would rate Torres last. They all three are fundamentally different. They are all 3 different speeds. The Pujols and first Cabrera gif can be most closely compared because the pitch is most similar. I can say that Cabrera here, has more bat wrap. But for me that does not make a longer swing. It is the time the hands move from load to contact. If you don't like that definition, too bad!
They also hold their hands away from their shoulder more, which I prefer. The others you can assess, but you can't compare. The one thing and only thing I will say in addition to the hand location issue of Torres is that I don't think his hips are explosive enough. As to what this gif in particular has to do with O'Leary, I don't know. What does he think of it? You can't give me the same angles, and you don't give me the same speed. How would O'Leary change it? I can't answer for him.

I have to be honest with you. I find a lot of you guys offensive. Especially from the northeast, though Teacherman is an exception. It is just politics. I don't believe you when you say you aren't part of the "group". Your tactics are very similar to Marcus. I just honestly don't find you engaging.

Steve,

You were the one that became obnoxious. I took it and took it some more but enough was enough. I told you numerous times I was not with any group. That I was an individual but you kept lumping me together with others. I know why. It is to gain sympathy. You want people to think you are being ganged up on. You want every body to think that we are all tied together through Richard. Hoping that that will some how make my comments less meaningful.

The gif had nothing to do with O'Leary. I originally posted it because it was the only gif I could find with someone who is connected to rotation and creates a long swing. You guys made it about O'Leary. Especially when you kept lumping us all together. I decided to lump you and O'Leary together.

To be honest with you. I am from California. I find guys like you to be pompous rear*s who think you know everything but are just winging it all of the time. You hate it when questioned because you aren't sure of yourself and your confidence waivers. You then have to keep making up stuff to try to sound smart. You then play the you guys card or start the insults and misquoting to try to cause confusion.

My tactics are my tactics. I'm glad you don't find me engaging because that would mean I agreed with you. Those are the only people you find engaging right?