Prayer circles after games

[quincy]

I agree with Sparky Guy, great question but this thread has run its course.

 

[CycloneSoftball22]

Those four words are EXACTLY why it is a problem, and exactly why it's not just "okay" to invite another team to a little prayer circle. A long time ago the people in charge found it was better just to pat the zealots on the head and say "okay you can have what you want" and allow things like those four words to be printed rather then to upset them and have the nutjobs run around screaming hellfire and damnation about the people in charge not agreeing with their beliefs.

Many kids will act the same, even though it makes them uncomfortable, they'll agree to it and suffer through it rather then risk some crazy zealots preaching to them and making all sorts of noise if denied.

Lets be honest here. Christianity (and all the other Abrahamic religions like Judaism and Islam) is a religion based on believing in a particular book that was re-written and re translated from its original form at least three times by kings and emperors who used it as a mechanism to control their subjects. I'm not saying that there isn't some basis in fact and some good lessons to be taught in such a manner, but for a lot of us, we'd rather our children be taught to figure out the world for themselves and use their own minds rather then simply do what they're told because it's an easier mechanism for those in power to exact control on those they wish to subjugate.

Now that I've preached to you about the my world views, which I'm sure you don't agree with, do you understand how those kids might feel? I'm guessing not a lot of teams decline invitations and reference believing in fairy tales or invite the other team to sacrifice a bat to the sun god before a game. I just think it would be nice to return the favor. I realize a lot of religions mandate that their loyal subjects practice evangelizing to their surrounding unwashed masses, but that does not make it any less offensive to those who believe differently.

Return the favor.

-W

Yes , this thread has gotten ridiculous.

 

[GOINGDEEP]

Those four words are EXACTLY why it is a problem, and exactly why it's not just "okay" to invite another team to a little prayer circle. A long time ago the people in charge found it was better just to pat the zealots on the head and say "okay you can have what you want" and allow things like those four words to be printed rather then to upset them and have the nutjobs run around screaming hellfire and damnation about the people in charge not agreeing with their beliefs.

Secretary Chase instructed James Pollock, Director of the Mint at Philadelphia, to prepare a motto, in a letter dated November 20, 1861:
Dear Sir: No nation can be strong except in the strength of God, or safe except in His defense. The trust of our people in God should be declared on our national coins.
You will cause a device to be prepared without unnecessary delay with a motto expressing in the fewest and tersest words possible this national recognition.

Congress ( who are voted by the majority correct?? ) passed legislation in 1863 and 1864 to include the inscriptions on our nations currency.

but for a lot of us, we'd rather our children be taught to figure out the world for themselves and use their own minds

How's that working out? Are we really better off a country and civilization than we were 50-100 years ago? Can you leave your doors unlocked like your grandparents? How about crime statistics, wonder which era was better? Hows divorce, teen pregnancy, drug and alcohol abuse now compared to then?

Religion to most is a passion, not much different than our passion for softball. If I ask my non-athletic neighbor to come see a game, does that mean he will be offended? What if he does come and falls in love with the sport? If you are married at one time you had to ask your wife out, correct? If you never took that chance would she be with you, it doesn't just magically appear.

That's all an invitation is, simply an invitation. It really sounds like the adults are more insecure than the children. You know the prayers I have heard in the circle are pretty short and mostly never use the word God anyway. "Thank you for a great game, protect our new friends, bless us and keep us safe, Amen". The hint of someone watching over and protecting us is what makes it more spiritual than just standing up and saying the words without "Amen". Sure doesn't sound scary or offensive to me.

I have not been to church in a long time, but still pray for guidance. I see a large increase of teenagers returning to church, even if their parents do not. Do they see something we do not? Are they looking for "something"......some optimism, group support, searching for the meaning of life, in a world that has become so corrupt from street thugs all the way to Wall Street and the Capital?

I have enjoyed all your inputs, and love you guys.

 

[Cannonball]

Last year in a tournament, dd's team was asked to pray after a game by a team from Louisiana. Our team had never had anyone ask us to do that before. However, girls joined in and actually spit up and alternated in the circle with the other team. We won a close game but afterwards, many, if not most, of that team came over along with their parents and we all sat around talking. In our situation, it led to some good friendships being formed.

 

[SoftSocDad]

I know this forum is evolving, but I'm not sure we've reached a point where protracted conversations about any aspects of religion or political beliefs fit within the site's primary missions. A mention here or there is fine and I think the original question was worth asking, but am I out of line in saying we're way beyond that now? I know it's my right not to click on the thread and I also know it's not my job to police the board, but conversations like these run the risk of tainting the reasons many of us come here.

 

[starsnuffer]

Congress ( who are voted by the majority correct?? ) passed legislation in 1863 and 1864 to include the inscriptions on our nations currency.



How's that working out? Are we really better off a country and civilization than we were 50-100 years ago? Can you leave your doors unlocked like your grandparents? How about crime statistics, wonder which era was better? Hows divorce, teen pregnancy, drug and alcohol abuse now compared to then?

At the time, the only people allowed to vote were white, land-owning men. In 1863, the enrollment act was also passed, which was the first legislated conscription for the US, due to the Union's inability to raise enough soldiers to fight in the Civil War. It can be argued that passing a bill to allow words be printed on currency was pretty much the same thing as passing a bill to build a bridge to nowhere as there were other pressing matters to be debated.

Are we really worse off? There were 1.5 billion people alive in the world in 1863, vs 6 billion today. There was a national opium addiction epidemic in the late 1800's that became worse until around 1914 or so. Average life expectancy was 43 years and the infant mortality rate was 34% I'm gonna have to disagree with your assessment.

Look, here's what we've learned from this thread: Those who are religious are all for both prayer circles and inviting other teams to join. Those who are not religious have nothing against prayer circles, but would rather not be asked to join. For thousands of years people have slaughtered, maimed, tortured, and tormented one another over religious differences, so I doubt we're going to do any better on a softball forum on the internet. We're just going to have to learn to accept that different people feel differently about things, and no matter what is said, differences of opinion are here to stay.

-W

 

[Sweet Lou]

Religion is a divisive issue. My personal feeling is it should stay out of sports. I agree with starsnuffer, if teams as a group want to introduce it, they should keep it to themselves.

 

[GOINGDEEP]

Sluggers may close at anytime. Again I have enjoyed the views from my fellow softball members and opinions from around the country.*

No doubt we are a "softball" family, and we all know that even the closest of families have their own individual opinions and lifestyles.*

On a good note, I'm sliding out of the house for the first game since my surgery. It's my daughter's friend boy, they start BB playoffs tonight. They suck bad, so at least I may be home early.

 

[lostbayou21]

I'm glad this subject was brought up. We play USFA ball in the Deep South and after EVERY game, there is a prayer circle where the two teams gather around, quote the Lord's Prayer, then end it with a loud "softball on three-1,2,3 Softball!" Good game everybody! It's now moved into our Dixie program.

Is it a sincere prayer? Probably not for most of the kids, it's more ritual, especially if you're playing 4 or 5 games in a day. However, the girls just gather at the mound. I've never seen a coach herd them there. In fact, some of the coaches remove their hats and bow their heads while others will take a few steps back and share a few comments with an assistant or umpire, etc.

While the girls are praying, I'm saying my own little prayer, usually something like thank you Lord for blessing these children, and keeping them safe. And I am very sincere---because we all know how quickly it can turn tragic, on and off the field.

 

[3sDad]

LOL...Whats really funny, the anti-religious folks want to take away the privilege, act...whatever you want to call for kids to simply say a prayer together in the middle of a dirt infield...Its not a huge event...The invitation is usually just a hand gesture, 99% of the teams fall right in...like someone stated...its soothing and you see the stress of the game with the 1st line of the prayer...some who are pouty about losing sometimes don't but that's ok....its not a revival and nobody passes a plate... nobody pulls out a Bible and stats whacking folks with it...no one will make you come nor will they ask twice...just isnt a big deal...

We'll be on the road this summer as soon as HS ball is over...so please list your teams name so we wont infuriate you by offering to say a meager prayer with you...and for the record we say a prayer on the INTERCOM before every HS game...

And as far ANY other religious belief...If you wanna pray...such as Muslims...break out your mat and compass and knock yourself out...
As far as Atheists...put your fingers in your ears.

One thing I'll share with you all after 28 yrs service in the US ARMY...and I'm not a Bible thump-er...But I've never been in a fighting position or a fire fight with someone who was claiming to be an atheist...prayers aplenty flying

You don't want to participate?...Don't... but there's no sense getting your drawers in a wad...and just for the record, I seriously doubt we'd play with any sanctioning body that didn't allow it...Most have a Sunday service also...
So you have a Blessed Day on Monday...