not closing the hips

[vbryant]

we were talking to a pitching instructor that we are thinking about taking dd to, the style he teaaches does not involve closing the hips, instead he wants them to stay open. anyone have any opinions on this, i have seen other girls he has instructed and they seem to look pretty good.

 

[sluggers]

I'm not sure quite what the guy is teaching, but it sounds like he is on track.

But, some background:

In the 1980s, many instructors taught "slamming the door" and aggressively closing the hips when. When fastpitch softball for girls exploded in the 1990s, there was a lot of study of female pitching. As a result of all that study and work, the "slam the door" method was abandoned. I don't know of any good instructor teaching it in 2010.

Additionally, the single most common problem with new pitchers is closing early. This is the pitcher who closes her hips early and drags her arm around the hips. This problem is endemic with pre-pubescent pitchers who don't have hips and bosoms to worry about. As a result, good pitching coaches are always talking about "staying open" when pitching.

BUT, that isn't quite the whole story. The truth is that the hips close to about 20 degrees (with 90 degrees being fully closed and 0 degrees being fully open) prior to release of the ball. The exact amount of hip closure for optimum efficiency is a really esoteric area--in other words, it ain't worth the effort until your DD is throwing 67 MPH and has a drop and a rise.

 

[RichK]

Sluggers, what do you look for to see if a young pitcher is closing her hips too early (other than, of course, looking at her hips). Is there a consistent result (high in the zone, lack of speed, etc) due to this? Any other signs of this problem? Tks.

 

[BoardMember]

Sluggers, what do you look for to see if a young pitcher is closing her hips too early (other than, of course, looking at her hips). Is there a consistent result (high in the zone, lack of speed, etc) due to this? Any other signs of this problem? Tks.

Trapped arms........Flying elbows.........Inside dirt balls.........Outside high balls..........Excessive arm/hip collisions.........Hand on top at 3:00........Pushing through release.......Mechanical syncronization issues...........Finish at the throwing arm shoulder.........High Finishes............Front foot exessively open to the catcher at release............

The list is endless..........

 

[vbryant]

thanks so much, im not sure exctly what he teaches either, we will find out in sat at her first lesson, funny thing about what you said is that "slamming the door" is exctly what her old instructor teaches....

 

[drc9805]

I still see people teaching it and I even almost bought into it myself but my DD's instructor just told me to watch the College World Series this year and see how many girls there were slamming the door. She was right...I think I saw exactly zero!!!

 

[redhawkridge]

To: drc9805
Unfortunately, I also watched a lot of the CWS this year and saw a significant number of pitchers who drive their pitch-side hip forward before the pitching hand passes it. In fact several exhibited minimal opening of the body/hips in their delivery. Just goes to show that at the D1 college level, the athletes can be successful even with fundamentally problematic mechanics.
My problem with students is that they tend to depend on the hip closure as a substitute for upper body strength to achieve speed when they don't have the confidence in the windmill to do the job -- I spend hugh amounts of time teaching that the windmill and proper IR at point of release will achieve greater speed with more accuracy. The pitchers I watched in the CWS certainly didn't make my task any easier.
jim

 

[vbryant]

well wentt to see the new instructor, and i do like what he teaches, it makes sense to espically since my dd has a problem with leaning, the way he teches it is impossible to lean, he said why he has started teaching this open hip style is that the closing the hips style involves alot of prefect timing and tends to pull the shoulder forward, we will see if dd can make the transition eaisily, he seems to think that she wont have a problem.

 

[Old Man River]

I'm not sure quite what the guy is teaching, but it sounds like he is on track.

But, some background:

The exact amount of hip closure for optimum efficiency is a really esoteric area--in other words, it ain't worth the effort until your DD is throwing 67 MPH and has a drop and a rise.

I'm responding to this last sentence- YOU CAN'T BE SERIOUS !!! I agreed with everything you were saying until this last sentence. If 67mph is the key criteria, I need to get a job!!

 

[drc9805]

To: drc9805
Unfortunately, I also watched a lot of the CWS this year and saw a significant number of pitchers who drive their pitch-side hip forward before the pitching hand passes it. In fact several exhibited minimal opening of the body/hips in their delivery. Just goes to show that at the D1 college level, the athletes can be successful even with fundamentally problematic mechanics.
My problem with students is that they tend to depend on the hip closure as a substitute for upper body strength to achieve speed when they don't have the confidence in the windmill to do the job -- I spend hugh amounts of time teaching that the windmill and proper IR at point of release will achieve greater speed with more accuracy. The pitchers I watched in the CWS certainly didn't make my task any easier.
jim

Of the final eight teams I watched, I just didn't see it so I guess we will just have to disagree.