Honest question

[Eric F]

Funny...DD's HS was just the opposite. You had to be a pretty good player just to make the team. The typical starting lineup was an "all-star" group of TB players from well-known teams.

We have polar opposites in our league. At the top are teams where decent TB players are on the bench on varsity, or playing JV. At the bottom are teams with zero TB players. Last year, my DD's HS team had more players who had never been on a softball field before than they did TB players. Every game except one was a run-rule finish, win or loss. Her team went 6-8. My DD has been the only '22 player on her team every year, and was the team MVP as a freshman. There have never been more than 4 players with TB experience on the team. The killer is that there are quite a few talented players in the area. Most of them (including 2 of her TB teammates) go to private schools. This year will be brutal. Our only pitchers graduated last year. I'm praying for a magical unicorn freshman with a hot arm and a good change up.

 

[sluggers]

I'm saying, couldn't the entire premise be flipped so that high school wasn't dismissed and looked down upon and was made to be more competitive?

People knowledgeable about softball don't "look down" on HS softball. It is different than TB...e.g, the coach can't go out mid-season and steal a pitcher from another team.

No one dismisses high school football as being inferior, do they? And those teams require dozens of players.

There is no viable alternative to HS football. It is a ridiculously expensive sport.

Other sports (basketball, baseball, track, soccer, hockey) are like softball. There are travel teams where the skill level of the kids are higher than in HS.

Sure, perhaps the others could catch the eye of a JUCO coach but, really? Seems one might be able to walk on at a JUCO if a decent player.

1. There are top tier softball Jucos and lower level Jucos. The top tier recruit. A mediocre players isn't going to be able to "walk on" to a top tier Juco program and play.
2. Juco coaches don't attend exposure tournaments. They aren't paid enough and have no travel budget.

I know this is really going outside the box and it's unlikely the wheel is going to be reinvented, but let's be honest about the reality. Thousands of girls, families and teams, are funding showcases for a chosen few.

You flatter yourself too much. It isn't outside the box thinking. Cathy Aradi--https://www.fastpitchrecruiting.com/ --has published a book about softball recruiting for at least 30 years. (Cliff Notes Version of her book: You make a list of schools your DD wants to attend. You contact the coach to express interest and send her/him a link to the video. You follow up with the coach. You go to the coach's camps. In other words, you find an interested buyer, and then you sell your DD's softball abilities. )

Many parents are confused about the recruiting process--and, to be quite blunt, many of them prefer to remain that way. The tournament directors sell the parents on these silly exposure tournaments.

 

[Eric F]

Why do we have 14U showcases? Asking for a friend. Just talked to a dad about his DDs 14U TB team. Their team traveled from So Cal to Texas and Ohio for showcases last month. That an estimated $7500 in a month. Stop the madness.

Any more, it's a money-grab (IMO). A few years ago, before they changed the rules about contact age, 14U was a viable showcase age, and we saw high-level coaches attending events.

From what I have seen, top D1 coaches are focusing mostly on 16U, trying to get the top-end talent identified before their competitors do.

Many times, D3, NAIA, and JC are just trying to find players who are a fit for their school and want to be there. Sometimes it can be a challenge. As @Strike2 mentioned, any decent 18U TB player who wants to play college ball can find a place, if playing ball is the primary objective. That said, I see a fair amount of 18U TB players who are ready to hang it up and move on to focusing on their academic path.

 

[Rolling Hard]

We have polar opposites in our league. At the top are teams where decent TB players are on the bench on varsity, or playing JV. At the bottom are teams with zero TB players. Last year, my DD's HS team had more players who had never been on a softball field before than they did TB players. Every game except one was a run-rule finish, win or loss. Her team went 6-8. My DD has been the only '22 player on her team every year, and was the team MVP as a freshman. There have never been more than 4 players with TB experience on the team. The killer is that there are quite a few talented players in the area. Most of them (including 2 of her TB teammates) go to private schools. This year will be brutal. Our only pitchers graduated last year. I'm praying for a magical unicorn freshman with a hot arm and a good change up.

Do you think that there may come a time that TB Coaches/Orgs. form leagues or have a general agreement that their teams are not going dark and play thru the HS season?
Why play for your well below average HS team with a teacher/coach telling you not to throw it so hard and you get 4 ABs a week when you can play quality TB on the weekends and get 12 or 14 ABs.

 

[CrazyNani]

Multiple reasons some of which have already been stated. some other ones are these. As cynical as it may sound, TB has now become big business for the most part. Those of them making money will not relinquish control of the almighty dollar.

Second, many girls are foregoing playing for their HS teams due to the coaching. Many coaches in my area have zero experience and are just doing it to pick up extra money. The ones that do as far as strategy and bas of knowledge goes, are teaching old school mechanics of just about everything from throwing to a swing taught 40 years ago. Since they insist on their players doing it "their way," many refuse to play for them.

Third, others aren't playing due to the "team atmosphere." Whether it's turning a blind eye towards bullying, other players not working as hard as the TB players would like, other players not caring about winning as much as the TB players, other players not caring if they improve as much as the TB players, etc. etc.

Finally, for the most part TB players play TB because they want to play and compete against a higher level player. When they are playing HS ball, they are usually playing against mixed teams and the competition isn't there.

Now I'm not saying that playing HS ball is right or wrong. You asked why many TB players don't and these are the reasons that I hear most often in my area. Thus, it's not going to go back to the days of HS ball being the all important team and colleges expanding their athletic budgets to hire scouts so they can send them all over the country to scout talent.

I guess my original thought was accurate, it isn’t about the girls at all. It’s about generating revenue. Most players and their families are simply being exploited.

 

[Eric F]

Do you think that there may come a time that TB Coaches/Orgs. form leagues or have a general agreement that their teams are not going dark and play thru the HS season?
Why play for your well below average HS team with a teacher/coach telling you not to throw it so hard and you get 4 ABs a week when you can play quality TB on the weekends and get 12 or 14 ABs.

I don't foresee that happening. My DD's HS team is very mediocre, but she still loves playing and representing her school. I know a lot of girls who are proud to play for their HS team. There are also quite a few HS coaches that are also TB coaches.

 

[Eric F]

I guess my original thought was accurate, it isn’t about the girls at all. It’s about generating revenue. Most players and their families are simply being exploited.

It's not all one thing or all another. There is a money-making component to it for the people putting on events (nothing wrong with that...mostly), but it's also creating opportunities for girls to find a path to college ball, if that's what they want. I don't agree that most families are being exploited.

 

[Shiloh]

So, I was a spectator at a showcase recently. I am not a coach or a scout. But I was struck by just how little real talent attends these things. Yes, the girls play well, and they don't. They get strikeouts, they strike out. They catch balls and they drop balls. My question is, what is a scout supposed to see there that is going to make a difference to any one of these girls? I have heard, that mostly the scouts go there with a few players in mind that are already on their radar. If it's true that so few girls actually get to play college softball, is it not then logical to think that these showcases are being put on simply to give those few girls a stage? How many other families are paying for those girls to be able to do this? I wonder, if girls only played high school ball and the expensive tournaments and showcases were not a priority, wouldn't it raise the level of high school ball in general? Wouldn't many families go back to living normal lives and maybe even being able to afford real vacations with their children? What if the high school teams became the Summer/Fall ball teams too, and played teams in areas closer to home? Wouldn't college coaches find a way to find the really talented girls anyway? I don't get it. It seems that the tail is wagging the dog and maybe, it's not about the girls at all. Just wondering...

Public school sports teams are limited to the talent found within their geographic borders.

What makes you think that, even with heavy investment, school-based teams would provide a competitive level of play, adequate coaching, and player development for a player who has national-level talent?

 

[Shiloh]

I guess my original thought was accurate, it isn’t about the girls at all. It’s about generating revenue. Most players and their families are simply being exploited.

TB was originally invented to give the very best players a chance to play against other similarly skilled kids, to learn from non-parent coaches, and to develop their talent. The first TB teams had to travel to find adequate competition, because the sport was small and there weren't many good players or teams. College coaches got wind of the upgraded level of play and wanted to see these really skilled kids and recruit them, so they started tagging along.

But they key thing is that this original TB framework - needing to travel to find adequate competition, needing high level coaching, needing high level development - only applied to a very small number of players, maybe a few hundred per year.

But don't tell that to the parents.

Enterprising coaches and greedy TDs, seeing that parents would spend $$$ to have their kids labelled a "travel player", blew the whole thing up.

*********************

So now, when you go to national tournaments, there is a "Premier" level and a "Platinum" level, a Tier 1 and a Tier 2.
Premier and Tier 1 are true A-level national TB teams, mostly (but not wholly) made up of national-caliber talent. Platinum and Tier 2 are teams made up mostly (but not wholly) of regional-level talent.

And even within each level, there is segregation, e.g. fields/locations where the truly top Premier/Tier 1 teams play. This is where you'll find the players and teams that are like those who needed to travel to play 40 years ago. This is also where you'll find boatloads of college coaches.

*******************

Easy to think the whole thing is exploitative for all but the most talented players, but that's not the whole picture:

The proliferation of TB teams, talent levels and colleges who follow them is nothing but good for the sport, even if the super-sizing of TB has come on the heels of greed and ego gratification. TB is great for family bonding and for making new family friends. The players actually do develop, become much better players, set themselves up to play college ball (which looks great on a resume), learn incredible life lessons, and they develop friendships with kids their own age who have similar interests, people they would not have otherwise known. Many teams also blend families of various ethnicities and socio-economic levels.

So each family does their own calculus on whether to save money by staying local, or maybe just play HS ball, versus travelling to SoCal or Texas or PA to play in a top tournament, to get seen by a mid-major D1 or HA D3 coaches.

Every family is different and they make the right choices for themselves.

It's all good.

But one last point - not trying to be mean - if you feel that TB is a waste and high school ball is good enough because your DD won't get recruited, or doesn't want to play in college, or even try to play in college, then TB isn't right for your family.

Cheers.

 

[Eric F]

So, I was a spectator at a showcase recently. I am not a coach or a scout. But I was struck by just how little real talent attends these things. Yes, the girls play well, and they don't. They get strikeouts, they strike out. They catch balls and they drop balls. My question is, what is a scout supposed to see there that is going to make a difference to any one of these girls?

Someone with experience working with players can recognize talent and athleticism pretty quickly. It can be seen in how they move on the field, their body language, their decision-making, their quickness to react, and their fundamental mechanics. These things are generally more telling than their success or failure on a routine play or an at bat.