Hitting with backspin- Fact or Fiction?

[obbay]

Just wanted some feedback on another topic where my opinion differs from DD's coach. Not trying to start trouble, but want DD to understand what is right/wrong and why. Sometimes we may just have differing opinions.

Coach has girls hitting off brush-top tee with the instruction to hit under the ball to put backspin on it and create line drives (DD's understanding of the instructions). If the science is correct, I disagree with the way it's being applied.

I held up a ball with a strip of electrical tape around the center and held a bat next to it. I explained to her that to deliver the maximum energy to the ball, the central axis of the round bat needs to meet the central axis of round ball. If you are trying to hit the ball in a way to create backspin, you still need to hit it close to the center. If you deviate from the center by more than the width of the tape, it will probably result in a pop up (or a high fly if it's hit hard enough). contact lasts for 1/2000 of a second and we are talking adjustments of fractions of an inch applied to a swing at full speed by 15 yo girls.

So my question is- "Hitting with backspin- truth or old wives tale"?

If true, is what I told DD correct?

If it's true, I'm thinking it's an awfully fine detail to try and apply to every hitter. Am I wrong?

 

[cshilt]

Looks good to me. How can you, with any consistency hit the bottom half of a ball in such a way as to create a line drive. It is beyond my pay scale. Sounds like a good suggestion for Jamie and Adam on Mythbusters.

 

[Cannonball]

First, you'd have to practice hitting on a downward angle. Next, you'd have to be so good that you can hit the bottom half. I don't doubt that backspin occurs on some hits. However, if you are that good so that you can hit the ball exactly where you plan, then why not go ahead and hit the ball out.

 

[tom.guerry]

I think the backspin idea is almost entirely scientifically incorrect.

A big benefit of the backspin type "feel" (as opposed to the supposed scientific backspin reality) is that you have a swing pattern with good plane matching that is squaring the ball rather than slicing across it. There is a longer hitting zone, larger tolearnce of timing error and better lined up contact.

I think the Epstein/Williams idea is somewhat superior which is that you learn how to plane match for a big zone, then when you are early you get overspin and late you get backspin.

when you miss you tend to be just under and foul ball straight back which means the swing was just slightly too late due to some loopiness which you try to tighten up by "setting sites higher"/slightly leveling out/shortening swing.

also ted always wanted to be slightly late rather than sightly early because when he was early the whole swing got messed up.

See SCIENCE OF HITTING and mikeepsteinhitting.com.

 

[SBFAMILY]

New product the Totalcontrolsports TCP ball. I use them. It teaches you not to hit the top 1/2 or bottom 1/2 of the ball. If you do the ball looks like a wounded duck. Now saying that, why would teach hitting the sweet spot on the ball and someone teach hitting the bottom 1/2. Your coach needs to go to a hitting clinic !

 

[Wellphyt]

It would be interesting to hear your DD's coaches' thoughts on plane matching. I have always associated the backspin approach to swinging down on the ball. The phrase "Swing Down on the Ball for Backspin comes to mind.

My DD isn't good enough to do that consistently. She just trys to hit the ball square.

 

[ssarge]

It would be interesting to hear your DD's coaches' thoughts on plane matching. I have always associated the backspin approach to swinging down on the ball. The phrase "Swing Down on the Ball for Backspin comes to mind.

My DD isn't good enough to do that consistently. She just trys to hit the ball square.

I agree that the physics concludes relatively little additional carry from imparting backspin (and into the wind, it may be less). Plus it is astronomically more prone to timing error to swing down to a downward moving pitch in order to try to hit the bottom 35% of the ball and create backspin. Plane matching is far better for a longer zone and more consistent contact.

Ted Williams put it more succinctly (if profanely).

"If you're that f***ing good, why don't you just hit the f***ing middle of the ball EVERY TIME?"

Eloquent, in a way.

Regards,

Scott

 

[Wellphyt]

I agree that the physics concludes relatively little additional carry from imparting backspin (and into the wind, it may be less). Plus it is astronomically more prone to timing error to swing down to a downward moving pitch in order to try to hit the bottom 35% of the ball and create backspin. Plane matching is far better for a longer zone and more consistent contact.

Ted Williams put it more succinctly (if profanely).

"If you're that f***ing good, why don't you just hit the f***ing middle of the ball EVERY TIME?"

Eloquent, in a way.

Regards,

Scott

Did Ted really say that? That's hilarious. I'm laughing out loud here...

 

[Shawn]

Just a different spin on the question,

Since it's been raining and I can't watch any games outside, I've watched several fastpitch games on TV. One girl in a post game interview talked about the pitcher throwing mainly drop balls and after having a good game at the plate mentioned trying to hit the bottom half of the ball or lower half. It's the same af setting your sight higher on a riseball and trying to hit the upper half.

It's not "really" about actually doing either, it's about taking into account movement and not swinging where the ball once was during the flight to the plate. So trying to hit the middle/lower part on the drop ball, helps to swing to where the ball might drop or move around the plate. So it's like the ball falling right into the swing, looking to hit the middle/lower half.

Some hitters can hit fly balls that carry out, although I only consider the "idea" behind hitting or looking for the top or lower part of the ball as really adjusting for movement. What the hitter see's in a riseball is more of the middle/bottom of the ball (closer to the plate) and what they see in a drop ball is more of the top of the ball. So, the cues are for swinging at the part you you don't see as well and where the ball is heading.

How many drop balls are chopped or hit on the top of the ball and how many riseballs are hit under the ball and straight back?

 

[Shawn]

I think the Epstein/Williams idea is somewhat superior which is that you learn how to plane match for a big zone, then when you are early you get overspin and late you get backspin.

This isn't very accurate IMO. When a hitter is late and jammed they hit the ball on the ground with top spin. When a hitter is late they can hit the ball straight back.

Yes, very goog hitters, Edmonds has an uppercut so he can put top spin on a ball if the bat is to far under the ball. Edger Martinez did this very well.

Over-all the statemant by Epstein isn't completely true or accurate.