FiveFrameSwing
Banned
Hips or the Hands or both simultaneously(lets keep it simple)?
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FiveFrameSwing
Banned
Batting cage swing for Josh Donaldson... Watch when his front foot lands. By that time, he is already torquing the handle of the bat. IMO, this is Shift AND Swing, instead of Shift THEN Swing. I have given up on the 1-leg/2-leg talk because there are too many interpretations. My interpretation of 1-leg is in line with what [MENTION=14754]pattar[/MENTION] stated in his post "front foot receives a majority of the pressure after swing launch". It's really no more complicated than that. Does the COG move towards the pitcher before that occurs? Sure it does. But that has never really been part of the 1-leg discussion. The COG can move forward and still be 1-legged.
‘By the time the front foot lands’... hmm. Front foot is needed? So 2 legs are needed?
Shift - move from one place to another. His COM/COG is moving somewhere else and repositioning itself before he swings yes? That would be shift THEN swing. There are 2 shifts ... the mass ... then the backside.
COM was brought into the 1 legged discussion to show the differences, so folks could really see what really happens. Before you or I were really involved here, the term was spawned because of the 1 legged golfer. Do you subscribe to that type of pattern? You don’t have to answer. I know you don’t.
If you have another example of 1 legged hitter do share. Because the only one I can think of is Judge(has to match the gurus one legged golfer example) We both know his pattern is vastly different from the other pros and hof swings we look at as examples. No need for an example, there isn’t one out there...
You have seen some of these kids posted here trying to be ‘one legged’ right??? Not even close to what you or I would consider a workable swing correct? Don’t you think clarification would be a good thing? For the betterment of this site, the people looking for help as well as just clear waters to wade through.
FP, I do respect your opinions and views but if your admitting that the mass shifts beforehand why can’t you just say what it truly is in lamens terms? Serious question. Don’t know why you hold onto this one so hard. If you say the front foot gets down before he launches isn’t that two legged?
I'm really not holding onto anything. There are multiple ways to look at this. Based on your definition of shift, I have no issue with you stating "Shift THEN Swing". When you talk about shift you are talking about something different than what I talk about. Our shifts are different, therefore our definitions are different. Some struggle with the "staying back" aspect of this, and tend to get "stuck" (my term). All they are doing is overbaking the concept. That can happen with any concept you choose to use. I look at the one legged golfer example as an extreme. I don't think the concept itself really had anything to do with the fact that the golfer had one leg. It had to do with what he was doing with his back hip and his launch. But some overbaked it to mean something it wasn't. That is typically what happens... Someone takes something out of context and runs with it.
For what it's worth I think this is an important viewpoint: "For the betterment of this site, the people looking for help as well as just clear waters to wade through." Unfortunately, many cannot have an open discussion about this stuff without trying to discredit others. To me, that doesn't accomplish a thing. State your opinions and provide whatever proof you want, but once people start with the discrediting garbage, the whole conversation falls apart. JMHO.
FYI. By my definition, each of these hitters is 1-legged...
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I'm really not holding onto anything. There are multiple ways to look at this. Based on your definition of shift, I have no issue with you stating "Shift THEN Swing". When you talk about shift you are talking about something different than what I talk about. Our shifts are different, therefore our definitions are different. Some struggle with the "staying back" aspect of this, and tend to get "stuck" (my term). All they are doing is overbaking the concept. That can happen with any concept you choose to use. I look at the one legged golfer example as an extreme. I don't think the concept itself really had anything to do with the fact that the golfer had one leg. It had to do with what he was doing with his back hip and his launch. But some overbaked it to mean something it wasn't. That is typically what happens... Someone takes something out of context and runs with it.
For what it's worth I think this is an important viewpoint: "For the betterment of this site, the people looking for help as well as just clear waters to wade through." Unfortunately, many cannot have an open discussion about this stuff without trying to discredit others. To me, that doesn't accomplish a thing. State your opinions and provide whatever proof you want, but once people start with the discrediting garbage, the whole conversation falls apart. JMHO.
FYI. By my definition, each of these hitters is 1-legged...
Fair enough. When you get a kid ‘stuck’. Will ‘shift and swing’help? How about 1 leg? I think not.
As far a what ‘someone’ wanted the 1 legged golfer to show ie back hip action is still not correct imo. It spawned AJs pattern. From the mouth himself. So with all of this being said... you still would describe the pattern ‘one legged’ to an aspiring young hitter?
Do you see the dilemma??? When actually described as what it is there is little to be left to interpretation correct?
Appreciate the back and forth.
I'm really not holding onto anything. There are multiple ways to look at this. Based on your definition of shift, I have no issue with you stating "Shift THEN Swing". When you talk about shift you are talking about something different than what I talk about. Our shifts are different, therefore our definitions are different. Some struggle with the "staying back" aspect of this, and tend to get "stuck" (my term). All they are doing is overbaking the concept. That can happen with any concept you choose to use. I look at the one legged golfer example as an extreme. I don't think the concept itself really had anything to do with the fact that the golfer had one leg. It had to do with what he was doing with his back hip and his launch. But some overbaked it to mean something it wasn't. That is typically what happens... Someone takes something out of context and runs with it.
For what it's worth I think this is an important viewpoint: "For the betterment of this site, the people looking for help as well as just clear waters to wade through." Unfortunately, many cannot have an open discussion about this stuff without trying to discredit others. To me, that doesn't accomplish a thing. State your opinions and provide whatever proof you want, but once people start with the discrediting garbage, the whole conversation falls apart. JMHO.
FYI. By my definition, each of these hitters is 1-legged...
Excuse me but doesn't TM say the one legged golfer is all about the rear leg and not using the hips? Or are you just saying it's about coiling the hip/back leg?
As I have stated numerous times... I don't use 1-legged or 2-legged when I talk to hitters. Forums are the only place you will see/hear me use either term. And even that is rare. Personally I don't like either term.
I am really not sure what TM states... So I will not comment.
I Don’t think it should be used ever... I only bring it up when I read 1 legged etc etc. The legs are just extensions just like the arms and shoulders. Get the core and hands right. The rest will get there imo. Have a good day FP.
In my experience people read too far into it. They may not understand it completely and then start speculating. Sometimes incorrectly. I personally like the phrase "forward yet back". When I see some people talk about 1 leg they seem to focus too much on the "back" but when others talk about 2 leg they focus too much on the front. Both are important IMO. And if doesn't matter if the hitter strides or not. That's why I posted Bagwell and Edmonds. Always good chatting with you W=W.
