Change-up Help

[Ken B]

Ken, coincidently, I just read your
Fastpitch tip for learning the finish of a backhand changeup
That's exactly what I meant by bending the elbow

I think that’s @Ken Krause ‘s article. Our change ups are different, although I do teach a drop spin change to kids who are ready.

 

[lhowser]

lhowser, 99 of 100 people would describe the "horseshoe" as where they grip the ball.

In the above video, I do see what you're describing (fingers not behind the ball) but, I also see a Mike White type wrist lock which is actually preventing the snap.

This video could easily be seen as a MODIFIED style flip change.

You are probably right about what others call horseshoe change-up with the grip. When I teach it I just say something like - "What is the last thing on a baseball or softball that causes it to have speed? It's the fingers behind the ball. If we work our fingers around the ball you can't push it anymore so it's much slower...plus your arm looks just like the other pitches". "As a check point your hand should be at a position that looks like an upside-down horseshoe at release".

I always see a flip as a pitch where the poor pitcher is trying to impart backspin

 

[gator5]

16u lefty struggling to develop a consistent change up. Has a good curve and drop but struggling to find any consistency with a change. Currently throwing a flip.

Any advice

Oh the struggles are real. My daughter fought with the circle change, with the index finger kind of digging into the ball, for years. Over the summer, at the advice of someone on here, she now leaves her index finger slightly off the ball. So (hopefully) from 43 feet away, the batter can't tell the change of grip. Same concept, though.

And strangely enough, when she was forced to chance her stance due to injury, suddenly her change up, which was by far her worst pitch, became a great pitch.

 

[Tango]

The change up discussions are always interesting to me. I get to see all of the descriptions of each change up: This one is a "horseshoe". This one she puts her knuckles on it. Etc.

All of that is well and good but it doesn't tell me how you took the speed off the ball. Gripping a ball by the "horseshoe" does almost nothing for reducing speed into a change up. SOMETHING else is happening to make the ball go slow. She locked her wrist, doesn't whip the arm, or whatever are all acceptable answers. But, to say "horseshoe" doesn't tell me a lot. And, i'll take it one step further since I'm in the mood. For almost all change ups, the grip on the ball is completely irrelevant. SOMETHING else is done to take speed off the ball, not your grip. I guarantee someone who claims to throw a "horseshoe" will get the exact same result with a different grip. The grip doesn't matter if the wrist gets locked, if the arm doesn't whip, if the wrist flips backward, or whatever. The speed is reduced by something other than your grip on the ball so lets stop pretending there is a right or wrong grip. If she's not "getting it" with whatever change up she's working on, altering the grip won't matter. It's a new release that she needs not a new grip of the ball.

if you grip the ball on the horseshoe seams with your thumb and index (fingers togethe) and push the ball like throwing a cup of water, I feel it allows the ball to drop out of your hand. Of course the action takes speed off but the grip does also, IMO. My favorite but only one of my kids uses this one. I do not like that great hitters can possibly see the grip

 

[GELLO]

Lots of great advice... We had a chance to get in a lot of work today and she was able to consistently throw the change up well. Thanks to all of the advice. She worked hard on getting her fingers around the ball instead of behind. She would finish thump down and she really drove hard off the mound.