Can batter/runner over run 1b on base on balls

[Westwind]

There are 2 different rules floating around.

The one that is gaining traction is not to pitch to batter and just give them 1st. Could see that being dead ball and batter frozen on 1st.

The normal rule were pitcher needs to throw the pitches, no restrictions.

Yep- saw that for first time this week, just sent batter to 1 with no pitches. Coach might have called time prior to talk to ump so dead ball either way.

Indyhscoach, I see 2 left I defended all the time......

 

[quincy]

Where P got in trouble was making a play on runner, if she just stood there and stared at the runner she should have been called out.

 

[Westwind]

Quincy- I don’t think so because she had not yet returned to first base. This is cut and pasted from an explanation I found: “when the pitcher has control of the ball inside the pitcher's circle and does not attempt to make a play on any runner, then all runners who are on base must stay on the base”. Here is a NFHS presentation on look back/delay. I believe USA softball is essentially the same.

https://nfhs-softball.arbitersports.com/Groups/105414/Library/files/Rule 8 - Lookback Rule.ppt

There are some nice documents on the NFHS site re DFP/Flex and various rule interpretations.

 

[3afan]

Where P got in trouble was making a play on runner, if she just stood there and stared at the runner she should have been called out.

why out? the runner never stopped, never returned to 1b so the look back rule never came into play.

 

[quincy]

Runner is out, she made a move towards 1st.

 

[CoachJD]

This one is really close. So the runner is in foul territory and appears to be walking back to first base, but if you look, she's always sort of angling herself toward fair territory. You could make an argument she was always going toward second base. And, regardless, she never went toward one base, stopped, then went to the other base. It was all one motion that just so happened to be going "toward" both bases at once.

I don't think she would have/should have been called out even if the pitcher didn't make a play on her.

 

[MTR]

Correct... unless she was intentionally walked, I was informed that was a dead ball situation.

You were misinformed

 

[MTR]

This one is really close. So the runner is in foul territory and appears to be walking back to first base, but if you look, she's always sort of angling herself toward fair territory. You could make an argument she was always going toward second base. And, regardless, she never went toward one base, stopped, then went to the other base. It was all one motion that just so happened to be going "toward" both bases at once.

I don't think she would have/should have been called out even if the pitcher didn't make a play on her.

Speaking USA/NFHS, the video shows a runner returning toward 1st after overrunning 1st. She is committed to 1st and should be called out based on the LBR.

 

[CoachJD]

Speaking USA/NFHS, the video shows a runner returning toward 1st after overrunning 1st. She is committed to 1st and should be called out based on the LBR.

Even though the pitcher made a play on her?

Anyway, I see her returning in a diagonal direction, not directly toward first base. I think it'd be tough to argue she was definitely "committed to 1st" in this case, though she probably was.

 

[Comp]

Even though the pitcher made a play on her?

Anyway, I see her returning in a diagonal direction, not directly toward first base. I think it'd be tough to argue she was definitely "committed to 1st" in this case, though she probably was.

I'm pretty sure that is a college game in the video and the rule is completely different in NCAA about returning to 1st base. NCAA allows the b/r who overruns first to attempt to advance to 2nd up until they actually return and touch 1st base. In any other rule set if that b/r overruns 1st and the ball is in the circle when they turn around and step back toward 1st they are no committed to 1st base under the lookback rule. It makes no difference that the pitcher attempted a play on her long after she already committed a lookback violation because in any rule set where this is a violation the ball is dead the instant the runner committed the violation.