Palm position from 9 to 6???

This clip (hope it shows, 1st time moving clip) by Rick Pauly got me thinking. First off thanks for posting Rick.

We or at least most agree palm up at 9. But as you go down the circle does the palm lead the ball to, say 7, then rotate to palm to 3rd, ala lead with picky till 6 then IR through?

I've heard lead with picky before but what does that mean and when does that start?

What is the bal hand relationship from 9 to 6? I think you get the gist of what I'm asking here.

I think 9 pinky, about 7 turning.

(Always pinky until the end, then let them do what they want)

So you start to lead with the pinky from 9 on down till release, staying inside the ball. This sound correct?

Any good video from behind the pitcher to show this? I'll be honest I haven't looked for any.

I'm working with young pitchers. Ranging from 10 to 13. Some with experience, most without. I see some trying to stay under the ball and, like Rick said in video above, jabbing themselves in the side. I tell them to relax with it and then they start leading more with pinky.

I was just wondering what was optimal and when leading with the pinky actually starts to take place.

With new/young kids learning to whip, sometimes less information is better. If you can ask them to pull the ball down, elbow flexed, palm up and let the ball whip out of their hand, you're off to a good start. I prefer to start the process using a net, tarp, backstop, etc, to take away the distraction of trying to hit a target. Once you try to force the hand into a position during the whip, they often stiffen up and loose focus on whip. That said, I mark nickel-sized dots on the axis points and occasionally suggest the kids try to throw the pinky-side dot at the target (similar to using a small football.)

From 9 to 7 you are working on the 'A' ... acceleration. Newton's 2nd law ... F = M x A.

I agree with both the above posts, even though 1 was a question.

I think Coach Scott knows what he is doing and just wants confirmation. I understand Ken’s point. Some pitchers point the ball towards 3rd base at 12, so I guess the pinky starts leading there. Big thing is what Ken mentioned is pulling the ball, not pushing. I personally like the pinky queue but I can understand why other people might not.

I like Ken’s posts but he threw a lot of info out there for starting with less information is better.

Less technical info to the kids. They do better with feel and cues as needed to get them heading the right direction. It's good for the person teaching to understand both the feel and technical aspects, but sometimes, too much focus on either can be counterproductive. Understanding what needs to happen, then find which cues work for each kid is the trick.

I agree the less technical for the kids the better. I start with BM's locked in drill. I help them to that starting position. Then tell them to just throw the ball underhand to an AC on a bucket. Don't worry were the ball goes, just relax and throw. . . . . I digress here but funny story. . . . I said this to a 10yr old beginner, had her in 'locked in drill' told her to relax and throw the ball. She uncorks and throws hard overhand to the AC on bucket, scared the crap out of him, Whoa! lol.

I try to stay as non technical as i can. Some young one are so gung ho they just want to go full force windmill right away. I tell them lets learn to throw underhand first, windmill will come. They are constantly unlocking and moving up the circle when we are starting this underhand throw.

Anyway back to topic, I like the DOT idea and will give that a try, thanks KEN.

Where I was going with this was as watching some young ones 'pitch' (from 'locked in' and liberty) I've noticed when telling them to pull the ball down that they do exactly as i say they pull the ball all the way down leading back of hand almost to thigh. They get into what looks like a very uncomfortable position. I go back to the relax part and tell them to then lead with the pinky. What I've noticed is that some are still pulling back of hand down further than others before leading with the pinky. Some start leading with pinky right after 9, some closer to 7/8 area. The ones that come down further I can see more of a point in the elbow to the side but not necessarily poking them in the side. Is this individual make-up (bodily) or is there an optimal point in which to lead with pinky?

I know in my older frame that if I force my back of hand to lead at about 7/8 position I can feel tension in my upper arm towards shoulder. I'm thinking that may not be good. If I start leading with the pinky between 9 & 8 it's a lot more comfortable.

This board is more knowledgeable than I so I'm posing the question. I need to be the best coach I can be and this board is where, I feel, the best hang out!

I know in my older frame that if I force my back of hand to lead at about 7/8 position I can feel tension in my upper arm towards shoulder. I'm thinking that may not be good. If I start leading with the pinky between 9 & 8 it's a lot more comfortable

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I think a key word here is "force." I prefer something more along the lines of setting up the optimum conditions for whip to happen, then help them to feel it. Snapping a towel works for some. BoardMember has talked about the lower arm taking the energy from the upper arm. Whip is allowed to happen--not made to happen. Once you feel it, it makes more sense.

Other than starting palm up, let the lower arm be loose--only holding on to the ball tight enough for it to whip out of the hand. At first the ball may go early, late, right, left, over the backstop, etc. As they get the feel of it, they also start to control it. As they start to control it, start moving back until they're about 2/3 distance, then try an adult catcher and play catch. Keep going back as long as whip holds together.

I'm at work over lunch here, so I'd like to ponder over what you've written so far. I really appreciate your time. I may have used the wrong word when I said force but still I am looking for the " optimum conditions for whip to happen". I may be trying to split hairs here.

I'll post more later this afternoon or early evening as I think this over. Thanks again.