HS - Do you have your ace pitcher go for the K's or the easy gounders?

[JJsqueeze]

Strikeouts over groundballs hands down.....for the reasons mentioned above. My DD is a groundballer for now and I am grateful that she keeps it in the infield, but it would be great to see her be able to hit another gear and blow it by a girl when needed. Especially on those hitters counts. Also, when she gets an ump that is not giving the knees she is really exposed.

One thing I don't understand is why more pitchers don't have both? I can understand the drop baller not mastering the rise ball, but rise ballers not being able to develop a good drop doesn't compute for me. When I watch Escobedo I always think she would be even more devastating if she had a drop.

FYI- Cat has been quoted as saying her favorite pitch is a drop and she was a strikeout pitcher if there ever was one.

 

[GOINGDEEP]

It's really difficult to compare HS pitching strategies across the board. What works for some, will not work for others. My "normal" TB girls ( not including random pickups ) went into the same HS. They were very defensively solid, especially on the left side. ( two D1 fielders now ) Because of the confidence in the fielders, we worked a good bit on the handle/end of the bat, especially if a runner was on to turn a double play. Of course it didn't always work, but worked often enough to win a lot of games with that strategy.

MS244 is about right on the 50%. In HS DD averaged 1.5 K's per inning over a season, about the same for TB. We also played a pretty tough schedule against schools from all over the east coast. If we just played a typical HS schedule that k% may/may not have increased.

I will add this about DD's senior year, our SS missed out on the end of the season because of hip surgery, our 3b broke her hand right before playoffs. That literally killed our "instilled" strategy. The replacement fielders we about 1/4th the athletes. At that point we are in the playoffs, no easy road thru district, regions, sub state, state. As most will tell you, your not going to change a pitcher's style in a couple of weeks, so they pitched the same way they had been for 9-10 years. We barely made it back to state, but didn't do well because of the defense inadequacies.

DD is still unable to pitch for her college, knee problems. I'll be REAL honest here, I don't think her method of pitching would be productive on her team now. The defense is sad, mighty sad. I've almost forgotten what a double play looks like. DD doesn't have HUGE amounts of movement, but what she does have is a very sharp late movement east and west. Her way of pitching, along with a good defense and some big sticks, won a bunch of games in TB/HS.

Sorry for the boring examples, I wanted to show that the method can be productive, but rely heavily on the surrounding circumstances of the entire team for it to work.

 

[bucket pinata]

Ill take the strike out pitcher every time period. Being one does not mean your hanging beach balls over the plate when you miss and it should mean you move the ball high and low with a good change curve whatever.. What I see with ground ballers that use the drop primarily is the same thing I see with pitchers heavy on the rise. neither are called strikes most of the time. So once the batter decides to lay off the low cheese and forces you to bring it up the hits start coming. then what? You tell them to just start striking out batters? If that same drop baller happens get an umpire that calls a higher zone better get a quick hook or your in for an ugly game. I have to talk with both my DDs coaches not to make them one dimensional. Get ahead and then make the batter go fishin.

 

[Momo'sDad]

The fewer pitches, the better. If I'm getting my wish, there's never a hitter's count. If you haven't ever seen a 3-pitch inning from the coach's position, you'll just have to trust me when I say that it's a beautiful thing.

If our ace only throws 80 total pitches in 2 full games on Saturday vs throwing 150, then she's going to be that much stronger for us as we advance on Sunday.

 

[softball88]

My DD in 10u and 12u has thrown 9 pitches 3 K's in the inning. For tournaments I rather see her through 3 pitches 3 outs. It's a great feeling at 14U when she throws 9-10 pitches total in the first 2 innings in 90 degree heat. She will throw a good rise and watch a pop out.

 

[JJsqueeze]

I would flip this question and ask from the offensive side...which would you prefer, a strikeout or a ball in play? No one is going to say strikeout and You can't say on the offensive side that you prefer a ball in play and then say the same for the defensive side. Bottom line....a ball in play has the chance for bad joo joo. I watched a routine grounder turn into a home run in D1 this weekend. I think it was even a PAC-10 game. Sure the three pitch inning happens occasionally but this is just a statistical fluke, the reality is that a strikeout is the safest way to get a girl out.

If I am drafting a team and I have a choice between a girl that throws a bunch of Ks and a girl that throws a bunch of grounders, given equal ERA etc. I am choosing the strikeout pitcher.

As for rest, just have a #2 that is a groundball pitcher to keep a lid on things and spell the ace when she gives you a nice fat lead with her Ks.

 

[daddiox2]

I know I put the Bull Durham line earlier, but as the father of a first year 12U pitcher on a very green first year 12U team that has defenders that are a work in progress... I would rather the Ks. However, DD is not a flame thrower. She will get some Ks, some swinging, some looking (and some drop thirds). The defense really does make me nervous, not just fielding the ball, but making the throws too.
The team is coming along.

Here's the concern, if you only ever play on a team where you have the flame throwing pitcher busting it past everyone, how will the fielders get the experience they need to grow as players (other than practice). Game experience as a fielder is important too.

...Back to the original questions. If the pitcher is capable of Ks and yet the pitch calls is setup to get weak grounders, perhaps this is not a bad thing when its working. The team feels involved and you can demoralize the opponent. It can be nerve racking for the parents of the pitcher for sure, because if she misses on a pitch, that pitch could get hit hard; the pitcher takes the blame, even if the coach had another option of pitches to call.

I sort of rambled there with my thoughts, but I hope it made some sort of sense.

 

[JJsqueeze]

conversations that never happened..

Nolan- We know you can strike everyone out but take a little off it to let the fielders get some work in.
Roger baby-Look, we love the Ks, but we pay more money for these infielders than you do for HGH and we want them to see some action.
Doc- I know you are hopped up on Coke right now but slow it down a bit and let the infield stretch their legs...

 

[daddiox2]

Yes, depends on the level. In HS, I would be going for the Ks. Or maybe in early season scrimmages or out of district games you might be giving the pitcher spots to hit to see what her control is on different pitches. This will help you build your strategy for the rest of the season (unless you already know the pitcher really well).

Maybe in a young travel team that is considered developmental, maybe the fielders need the in-game work.
Perhaps the way to do that is to let the flame thrower have her games against the toughest competition, and give innings to other pitchers against the second tier teams or the bottom of a line up or something.

Somewhere along the line as a coach, you are coaching the entire team, and not just the pitcher.

 

[Little Angels Softball]

conversations that never happened..

Nolan- We know you can strike everyone out but take a little off it to let the fielders get some work in.
Roger baby-Look, we love the Ks, but we pay more money for these infielders than you do for HGH and we want them to see some action.
Doc- I know you are hopped up on Coke right now but slow it down a bit and let the infield stretch their legs...

"Cat, quit makin' those Japanese chicks look stupid and let your infield win this for ya. If you do, you might throw fewer pitches."