Hitting into a Boxing Punching Bag: Good or Bad?

[mann]

As a drill used once in a great while, to have players get the feel of driving throught, no problem. But as a daily or weekly drill with lots of reps is NOT a good idea for players 14U and younger.

It puts too much stress on the wrist and shoulders of children. I wish I could find the link to the study that talks about this.

One day, put it away.

If my high school coach had his girls do this drill, some would have a sore something, because you must teach at the bag, you cannot just HIT IT.

This drill, I use to Teach. how to SIT INTO YOUR COIL, as you pull back into ROCK THE U. How to stay connected. how to TILT.
GRIP (don't start) contact positions. A GOOD PIVOt, HINGE, SERVE THE PIZZA.

Do not hit INFLATED BASKET BALLs, Volly balls, Footballs, EVER! Dead weight, with supervision.

 

[mann]

Plastic bat, IMO.

Also, the purpose is not to teach the feel of driving through. It's to teach the feel of ideal point of contact.

That's one thing, for sure Coogansbluff, but its more like a swiss army knife,

before and after much tighter swing.

 

[SBFAMILY]

Terrible drill. There have been many posts by Hitter and others about injuries related to this drill. Why would you want your bat to stop ?

Post by Howard/Hitter





I know I am going to catch the wrath of the baseball gods for this....We do not do this drill as it causes way too much stress in the shoulders, elbows and wrists. Crystl does not even do this drill and she could arm wrestle Statman and Ringer and beat them. We also do not hit tires or heavy bags or rubber tubes. We want them to think to the ball and through the ball and not stopping however feel the powering through the ball. The wrists, elbows and shoulders take a real shock when doing these drills. Crystl demonstrated nicking a light weight karate bag but not hitting to the point of stopping her swing.

At the NFCA Ralph Weekly (UT) showed hitting a 15 inch rubber tube and you could see the hitters faces frown like it was hurting to do it. At lunch wit about 15 other coaches present at the table I asked if anyone did this drill or hit basketballs....everyone said no not unless you want to have shoulder problems.

You want resistance for bat speed and follow through to extension not an almost stopping motion that using basketballs cause and getting them to extend through and finish over their shoulder.

We use a progression drill of soft tossing a tennis ball, hard ball, regular softball and a weighted softball weighing 10.8 ounces and then repeat. We also do a one knee drill to accomplish this.

I will not name the team BUT you know who you are...that did the basketball drills and I was working with three of their girls and all were complaining about their back shoulders hurting them and I turned around and ask the coach what they were doing as to throwing mechanics and he hung his head down and said it was not from the throwing mechanics...OK so what is it from....we were hitting basketballs! I told him you know better than that and why would you want to harm a young girls arm!

The one coach who had not worked with me before took it upon himself when the other coach who knew better was not there to try it out on the girls!

Ifubuildit: Hitting coach in Texas



I would highly recommend you NEVER DO THIS DRILL. With your DD or any team. It will result in injury.

Elliott.

Just to name a few ;
Howard again: You want to avoid coming to a complete stop such as hitting a tire or a basket ball. Talk to your orthopedic surgeon and ask what it does to your shoulder, elbow and wrist ESPECIALLY on the younger kids you are forcing this drill on!

There are other ways to strengthen the wrists and forearms than subjecting them to this drill. Learn a proper hand path and just swing a heavy bat if you want to increase bat speed.

 

[CoogansBluff]

Then don't swing so hard. Or use a plastic bat.

If the goal is to hit the bag (or worse yet, a tire) as hard as possible, then OK. I can see where that could cause an injury. But I've had my daughter swing into a bag w/ plastic bad, and I've seen the results. And there's no way this is causing an injury. It's far less jarring than hitting a soccer or basketball. Not even close.

 

[PEPPERS]

Terrible drill. There have been many posts by Hitter and others about injuries related to this drill. Why would you want your bat to stop ?

Post by Howard/Hitter





I know I am going to catch the wrath of the baseball gods for this....We do not do this drill as it causes way too much stress in the shoulders, elbows and wrists. Crystl does not even do this drill and she could arm wrestle Statman and Ringer and beat them. We also do not hit tires or heavy bags or rubber tubes. We want them to think to the ball and through the ball and not stopping however feel the powering through the ball. The wrists, elbows and shoulders take a real shock when doing these drills. Crystl demonstrated nicking a light weight karate bag but not hitting to the point of stopping her swing.

At the NFCA Ralph Weekly (UT) showed hitting a 15 inch rubber tube and you could see the hitters faces frown like it was hurting to do it. At lunch wit about 15 other coaches present at the table I asked if anyone did this drill or hit basketballs....everyone said no not unless you want to have shoulder problems.

You want resistance for bat speed and follow through to extension not an almost stopping motion that using basketballs cause and getting them to extend through and finish over their shoulder.

We use a progression drill of soft tossing a tennis ball, hard ball, regular softball and a weighted softball weighing 10.8 ounces and then repeat. We also do a one knee drill to accomplish this.

I will not name the team BUT you know who you are...that did the basketball drills and I was working with three of their girls and all were complaining about their back shoulders hurting them and I turned around and ask the coach what they were doing as to throwing mechanics and he hung his head down and said it was not from the throwing mechanics...OK so what is it from....we were hitting basketballs! I told him you know better than that and why would you want to harm a young girls arm!

The one coach who had not worked with me before took it upon himself when the other coach who knew better was not there to try it out on the girls!

Ifubuildit: Hitting coach in Texas



I would highly recommend you NEVER DO THIS DRILL. With your DD or any team. It will result in injury.

Elliott.

Just to name a few ;
Howard again: You want to avoid coming to a complete stop such as hitting a tire or a basket ball. Talk to your orthopedic surgeon and ask what it does to your shoulder, elbow and wrist ESPECIALLY on the younger kids you are forcing this drill on!

There are other ways to strengthen the wrists and forearms than subjecting them to this drill. Learn a proper hand path and just swing a heavy bat if you want to increase bat speed.

SB I was working on replying to this thread and saw where you had already replied and you said it better that I ever could have. I agree with ever thing you posted and I have a training video from UT where Weekly shows the drill you are referring to.

I have in the past used a fin that slips over the knob and slides to the barrel and increases resistance as the hitter swings the bat we also do the heavy light ball as you described. A good drill IMO.

Hitting through the ball, if you have seen in slow motion when the barrel impacts the ball on a solid hit. The bat flexes backward and the ball compresses, IMO keeping the barrel on the same plane of the ball for as long as possible and having a good finish can only add distance and velocity to the flight of the ball.

 

[SBFAMILY]

I have the fins. There are many ways to get the same results without taking a chance of an injury. Interesting that we have Doctor stating not to do this drill with young kids , but parents and coaches see no issues. You see the issues later in life when they get older. Ask some of the old timers that did this growing up. I was required back in the 70's to run with ankle weights in track. Ask a trainer today and they will tell you that coach was nuts. Off course I can hardly sneak up on anyone with the noise my ankles make today and I have already been told both knees will have to be replaced for all the stupid stuff I was told to do when I was a kid by coaches. Heck Bustos stated she wouldn't even do this drill. There are different weights that go around the hands that work better. Just dont add weights toward the end of the bat it will change the swing plan. Edge weighted gloves is what Bustos recommends. Funny Richard loves this drill and it just goes to show he doesn't work with young kids since he wants to make it out we teach a push. I didn't know he had a medical back ground! Talk to a Orthopedic surgeon about sudden contact force injures with teens. Google it ! Same reasons you don't threw a curve ball in baseball till your old enough. http://orthoinfo.aaos.org/topic.cfm?topic=A00613 This should give you an idea on this topic.

Children and Adolescents

Although playing sports can improve children’s fitness, self-esteem, coordination, and self-discipline, it can also put them at risk for sports injuries: some minor, some serious, and still others that may result in lifelong medical problems.

Young athletes are not small adults. Their bones, muscles, tendons, and ligaments are still growing and that makes them more prone to injury. Growth plates—the areas of developing cartilage where bone growth occurs in growing children—are weaker than the nearby ligaments and tendons. As a result, what is often a bruise or sprain in an adult can be a potentially serious growth-plate injury in a child. Also, a trauma that would tear a muscle or ligament in an adult would be far more likely to break a child’s bone.

Because young athletes of the same age can differ greatly in size and physical maturity, some may try to perform at levels beyond their ability to keep up with their peers.

Contact sports have inherent dangers that put young athletes at special risk for severe injuries. Even with rigorous training and proper safety equipment, youngsters are still at risk for severe injuries to the neck, spinal cord, and growth plates. Evaluating potential sports injuries on the field in very young children can involve its own special issues for concerned parents and coaches. Some helpful hints are presented in

 

[mann]

Terrible drill. There have been many posts by Hitter and others about injuries related to this drill. Why would you want your bat to stop ?

Post by Howard/Hitter

I actually agree





I know I am going to catch the wrath of the baseball gods for this....We do not do this drill as it causes way too much stress in the shoulders, elbows and wrists. Crystl does not even do this drill and she could arm wrestle Statman and Ringer and beat them. We also do not hit tires or heavy bags or rubber tubes. We want them to think to the ball and through the ball and not stopping however feel the powering through the ball. The wrists, elbows and shoulders take a real shock when doing these drills. Crystl demonstrated nicking a light weight karate bag but not hitting to the point of stopping her swing.

At the NFCA Ralph Weekly (UT) showed hitting a 15 inch rubber tube and you could see the hitters faces frown like it was hurting to do it. At lunch wit about 15 other coaches present at the table I asked if anyone did this drill or hit basketballs....everyone said no not unless you want to have shoulder problems.

You want resistance for bat speed and follow through to extension not an almost stopping motion that using basketballs cause and getting them to extend through and finish over their shoulder.

We use a progression drill of soft tossing a tennis ball, hard ball, regular softball and a weighted softball weighing 10.8 ounces and then repeat. We also do a one knee drill to accomplish this.

I will not name the team BUT you know who you are...that did the basketball drills and I was working with three of their girls and all were complaining about their back shoulders hurting them and I turned around and ask the coach what they were doing as to throwing mechanics and he hung his head down and said it was not from the throwing mechanics...OK so what is it from....we were hitting basketballs! I told him you know better than that and why would you want to harm a young girls arm!

The one coach who had not worked with me before took it upon himself when the other coach who knew better was not there to try it out on the girls!

Ifubuildit: Hitting coach in Texas



I would highly recommend you NEVER DO THIS DRILL. With your DD or any team. It will result in injury.

Elliott.

Just to name a few ;
Howard again: You want to avoid coming to a complete stop such as hitting a tire or a basket ball. Talk to your orthopedic surgeon and ask what it does to your shoulder, elbow and wrist ESPECIALLY on the younger kids you are forcing this drill on!

There are other ways to strengthen the wrists and forearms than subjecting them to this drill. Learn a proper hand path and just swing a heavy bat if you want to increase bat speed.

I actually agree with most of this.
No basketball, or TIRES.

The bag is fill with cushioning agents, and materials. Its a PUNCHING BAG. And IS NOT USED for wrist or arm conditioning, and actually the back arm and hand is held in the punching positional called the power L.

If you let the kids just wail on anything it will cause damage, even hitting a softball to much, the wrong way.
(

Nothing is worse than inflated basketballs, totally Wrong. RECOIL against poor wrist positioning, or even good wrist positioning.

I can use the bag drill, and not even hold the bat at contact.

Used Only with proper supervision and training at the bag, is this a good drill.

But I do respect everyone's opinion, and will look for signs of trouble.

4 years and none so far.

Me, I wail on it.

 

[Eric F]

...he wants to make it out we teach a push.

It seems to me that if hitting into a heavy bag is has the potential for wrist injury, the hitter would still be applying force to the handle of the bat at contact. It seems to my dumb brain that this would, indeed, be a "push" with the hands. If it's not, I'm curious to know why.

In the launch of the bat described by those who subscribe to the turn-the-barrel/SnF swing technique, there isn't any forward force being applied by the hands to the bat handle at the time of contact, and therefore the wrist injury issue is negated.

EDIT:

There are other ways to strengthen the wrists and forearms than subjecting them to this drill. Learn a proper hand path and just swing a heavy bat if you want to increase bat speed.

If you're hitting a heavy bag to strengthen wrists and forearms, you're doing it wrong. If that's the plan, yes, you're going to hurt yourself very quickly.

The drill is about increasing bat speed into contact, and the speed at which the barrel hits the bag is the indicator. If you're doing it right, all of the force on the handle to create bat speed is over before contact.

The door-slam analogy is perfect...
There are 2 ways to slam a door. Apply force to the door all the way until the door is closed, or fling it closed.

The first way is a push, and applying that to hitting a heavy bag will hurt you. Fling the barrel into the bag with a sudden/explosive launch.

 

[mann]

It seems to me that if hitting into a heavy bag is has the potential for wrist injury, the hitter would still be applying force to the handle of the bat at contact. It seems to my dumb brain that this would, indeed, be a "push" with the hands. It it's not, I'm curious to know why.

In the launch of the bat described by those who subscribe to the turn-the-barrel/SnF swing technique, there isn't any forward force being applied by the hands to the bat handle at the time of contact, and therefore the wrist injury issue is negated.

Holey cow EricF, that is so true, my main goal at the bag, is TURN the BARREL, do not PUSH your Hands.

There is no force from your hands at impact, I show the girls I can even let go, with two open hands.
Hence I do use the open hand drills, in all I do.

My sit portion at the beginning, is beginning teaching of stretch and fire. learning coil, and about the rear hip.

They learn to turn the barrel quickly.

This is 30 minutes at the bag from game swing to front toss, Barrel dump bat drag, to turning the barrel.

as a side note, I have hit basketballs, I have hit volley balls, beach balls ping pong balls.
HAVE YOU, to actually tried hitting a punching bag? or, he said she said?

I guess a good sign of failing to turn the barrel, would be a broken wrist, That'll teach em.

 

[GunnerShotgun]

A 100lb heavy bag for hitting and long toss for pitching are the drills that have produced the best results for me.

Any prop used in a drill can be dangerous, just use your head.