Throwing the mask off

[Greenmonsters]

Let's talk about stubbornness and considering facts and opinions. I'm the one that said if a catcher wants to keep their mask on it is fine. I never said it was wrong. I call it a preference. You're the one that is adamant about keeping the mask on. I am not the stubborn one here, you are. Yes, a catcher is more aware of their surroundings removing the mask on a high pop up. That's why the best catchers do it. If you don't want to believe that little tidbit of information, it's not my problem.

A good catcher sees the direction of the ball from contact. I said that since they know the direction they can find the ball very quickly, within hundredths of a second.

You need to understand the difference between a push and a pull, and the smoothness that the task is accomplished.


GM, since you consider NECC instruction as gospel, let's see your NECC instructed dd catcher in action. Throw some video on here and compare how my non-NECC instructed catcher compares to yours, with commentary on what my dd is doing wrong and how she should fix the problem. Maybe you can teach me something.

Keep it on, take it off, it's an individual decision. I see no good reason to take it off so that's what I teach and recommend. Everyone can decide for themselves, but I've yet to hear a sound argument that makes me think I'm handicapping those I worked with.

First, most catcher have not had good training. The best catchers aren't playing NCAA ball, they are playing MLB; however, many MLB catchers have faulty mechanics. As a Red Sox fan, I love Christina Vazquez' arm, but he lost at least 4 strikes last game I saw because of flawed receiving. Yady Molina has lost a lot of effectiveness as age and wear and tear have sapped the athleticism that he uses to make up for unconventional mechanics. FWIW, Jen Schro is the best female catcher I've seen over the years. With her athleticism, I can only imagine how good she would have been if she had been taught NECC techniques.

You still have no explanation as to why its harder for a catcher to track and catch pop ups than other fielders. It's very simple, 1) they can't use the same tracking methods; and, 2) they don't see the entire trajectory. Do an internet search for "science tracking fly balls" and reason 1 becomes apparent. For #2, it seems you've moved a little from your earlier position by admitting that the ball is picked up in several 100ths of a second.

WRT to your DD, she's advanced and very smooth receiving, but whether you call it a a push or a pull, she moves the glove while/after receiving. IMO, whenever a catcher moves their glove after catching a pitch, its a clear signal that the catcher thought the pitch wasn't good enough on its own merits and is trying to influence the umpire. The better approach is to stay low, center the pitch with the body, catch it with most of the glove in the zone, and stick it for a fraction of a second. Gives the umpire a good look, lets them do their job and doesn't insult their intelligence as any umpire worth their salt will claim that what a catcher does or doesn't do has no bearing on their calls. All that claimed and said, I'd like to hear blue's explanation for the ball call on the pitch nearly down the middle of the plate that the Michigan catcher (a girl who catches would be a more accurate description IMO) dropped.

As far a my DD goes, my objectives were achieved. DD was not an elite athlete, but sound mechanics and her determination and work ethic helped her get the most out of her inate athletic ability and she was able to achieve her goal of playing D3 college ball. I'm sorry, but I'm not as trusting as some and have refrained from publicly posting video or photos of DD. PM me and I'm happy to share privately with you as I have with a number of others here.

With respect to catching, I've been playing, coaching, and studying for the last 42 years. I'm happy to share what I've learned and believe and hope that my understanding continues to evolve when presented with alternative schools of thought.

PS I will readily admit that my posts today provide strong evidence as to why one shouldn't drive after drinking, watching WCWS, and posting on DFP.

 

[Lenski]

Keep it on, take it off, it's an individual decision. I see no good reason to take it off so that's what I teach and recommend. Everyone can decide for themselves, but I've yet to hear a sound argument that makes me think I'm handicapping those I worked with.

First, most catcher have not had good training. The best catchers aren't playing NCAA ball, they are playing MLB; however, many MLB catchers have faulty mechanics. As a Red Sox fan, I love Christina Vazquez' arm, but he lost at least 4 strikes last game I saw because of flawed receiving. Yady Molina has lost a lot of effectiveness as age and wear and tear have sapped the athleticism that he uses to make up for unconventional mechanics. FWIW, Jen Schro is the best female catcher I've seen over the years. With her athleticism, I can only imagine how good she would have been if she had been taught NECC techniques.

You still have no explanation as to why its harder for a catcher to track and catch pop ups than other fielders. It's very simple, 1) they can't use the same tracking methods; and, 2) they don't see the entire trajectory. Do an internet search for "science tracking fly balls" and reason 1 becomes apparent. For #2, it seems you've moved a little from your earlier position by admitting that the ball is picked up in several 100ths of a second.

WRT to your DD, she's advanced and very smooth receiving, but whether you call it a a push or a pull, she moves the glove while/after receiving. IMO, whenever a catcher moves their glove after catching a pitch, its a clear signal that the catcher thought the pitch wasn't good enough on its own merits and is trying to influence the umpire. The better approach is to stay low, center the pitch with the body, catch it with most of the glove in the zone, and stick it for a fraction of a second. Gives the umpire a good look, lets them do their job and doesn't insult their intelligence as any umpire worth their salt will claim that what a catcher does or doesn't do has no bearing on their calls. All that claimed and said, I'd like to hear blue's explanation for the ball call on the pitch nearly down the middle of the plate that the Michigan catcher (a girl who catches would be a more accurate description IMO) dropped.

As far a my DD goes, my objectives were achieved. DD was not an elite athlete, but sound mechanics and her determination and work ethic helped her get the most out of her inate athletic ability and she was able to achieve her goal of playing D3 college ball. I'm sorry, but I'm not as trusting as some and have refrained from publicly posting video or photos of DD. PM me and I'm happy to share privately with you as I have with a number of others here.

With respect to catching, I've been playing, coaching, and studying for the last 42 years. I'm happy to share what I've learned and believe and hope that my understanding continues to evolve when presented with alternative schools of thought.

PS I will readily admit that my posts today provide strong evidence as to why one shouldn't drive after drinking, watching WCWS, and posting on DFP.

Exactly right. It's a personal preference and nothing more. I have no problem teaching to keep the mask on. Trust me when I tell you that you are not hurting my feelings one bit. There's two camps to this debate, and the majority of the elite catchers remove the mask and it's not due to bad teaching. It's due to preference.

I have to disagree with you about the MLB catchers having faulty mechanics. It's more about getting lazy back there. The MLB instructors overall are the best of the best. We all can tell that most MLB catchers are not NECC taught, but that doesn't make the MLB catchers ill-instructed. They set up earlier, frame pitches, and are much more quiet behind the dish than the typical fastpitch catcher. The typical fastpitch catcher moves with the pitch, curls the wrist after receiving the ball, and move around much more while receiving the pitch and gets more behind the ball. Again, not wrong, just different. I taught my dd more like a MLB catcher rather than a typical fastpitch catcher. It worked for her as she is playing at the next level.

I've explained ad-nauseum concerning pop ups but you refuse to accept my answer. You think it is much different and I do not. My dd has no issues tracking pop ups. It is not hard for her because she practiced at it. The tracking methods are similar and the trajectory is easy to read. I never moved from an earlier statement concerning a catcher seeing the ball off of the bat. I've always said there is a split second (hundredths of a second) it's out of sight but immediately picked back up. I do stand by my statement that a good catcher does see the direction of the ball off of the bat. There is a difference. Knowing the direction helps a catcher immensely.

The way my dd receives does not insult anyone's intelligence. When a pitch is in the strike zone, she stays quiet and sticks the pitch. When a pitch is in the river, she stays quiet, catches the outside of the ball, and sticks it at or near the corner of the plate...all in one move. She does not move it into the plate, just at or near the edge of the plate. The umpire has a better view this way because my dd is not moving around behind the plate; she is static. For me, this is MUCH better than the catcher moving her body to center herself to the ball, receive the ball with a straight arm, catch the ball, then curl the glove in. Not one umpire.....EVER.....has said anything to her negatively pertaining to this. If an umpire says anything to her, it is praise.

I applaud you for helping your dd get to the next level. People don't realize the time and effort it takes. Our dd's sound similar: Not elite athletes but young ladies with sound (although different) mechanics with robust determination and work ethics. There's no need for me to see pics or videos as I'm sure she does a fine job at her craft and I respect your public refrain.

I'm like you. I have also played, coached, and studied the art of catching for well over 40 years. I am also happy to share my beliefs if anyone cares to ask and I am also willing to continue my education.

 

[InsidePitch]

I personally would be inclined to take it off would be for a play at the plate to avoid possibly being obstructed by the bars on a low throw that bounces high unexpectedly.

I disagree, catchers are used to digging balls out of the dirt with their helmet on. Take off the helmet and tell them to dig out short hops and the average HS age catcher will turn her head.

I never moved from an earlier statement concerning a catcher seeing the ball off of the bat.

What happens when everyone at the plate closes their eyes upon contact? Batter, Catcher and ump.