How to Improve Time to start throw to 2nd?

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Jul 10, 2011
146
18
Rockport, MA
When we practice our technique and throws with the ball starting in the glove they are so quick. However when we got to any live pitching, their speed from catching the ball, through transfer, and throw drops drastically.

Does anyone have any drills to help work on getting the speed back close to the speed they show when not having live pitching?

Tex,

Glad to hear that your girls are working hard to get better behind the plate.

First off, I do have to comment on Jim's suggestion to start turning the shoulder and knee early in an effort to speed up the release. The suggestion was certainly made with good intentions, but not only will this actually end up slowing down the throw because of the risk of the girls actually moving too far their left with their right foot as a result of the turn of the hips (can't turn shoulder and knee without the hips turning as well), but it will most definitely force each of these girls to develop a very flawed throwing motion, with their front side swinging open early during the throw. This will completely eliminate the lower half of their body in the throw, resulting in a push of the ball rather than creating whip of the arm with the drive and rotation of the hips and lower body. It is the lower half that should power a throw, not the turn of the shoulders.

We have to think of the throw as a continuous movement, but one with check points. Or rather, a row of dominos...when evenly spaced and pushed down in order, all of the dominos will fall, completing the motion. For arguments sake, let's say that the proper throwing motion has 30 steps or "dominos" (completely arbitrary number). Domino #8 is the rotation of the hips and shoulder towards our target. We take that domino out of the row and put it in front of domino #1. Now push them down. What happens when we get to domino #9? Nothing. We have to add a step or "domino" and now the throwing motion that should have 30 steps when executed efficiently, now has 31. Most of the time, the step/domino that is added naturally is the same one that was taken out. The turn of the shoulder and hips. We will end up over-rotating, pulling open far too early in the throw with our front shoulder, most likely causing the throwing arm to drift away from the body (possibly letting the elbow drop) and now we end up sailing the ball into high right into the outfield. All because we tried to turn early. I don't want to turn early, I want to turn on time. There is a proper sequence to a throw. Cheating at any point in the process will increase the release time and will disrupt the overall mechanical efficiency/accuracy in the throw.


One thing to remember when working with 10U's is that the momentum of the pitch may carry a force much greater than what their arms are physically able to handle. That "recoil" of the arm, hand and glove will most certainly contribute to a slower exchange, and thus a slower throw.

Also, one of the things that I have learned through all the years I have been doing this with my father is that progression of the training environment is pivotal in the development of skills. If they are always starting with the ball in their glove, then the second they experience the tactile feel of a ball hitting their glove, a different part of their brain will take over the reigns in the throw, completely ignoring the muscle memory they have developed during drills when the ball starts in their glove.

All this means is that these girls need to practice throwing off of more live pitches during their training sessions. The more they are able to adjust in a training environment to a moving ball, the easier it will be for muscle memory to take over during a game. It's sort of like the stances we teach. At first, I am sure some of the girls felt a bit of discomfort using muscles in their legs they had never been asked to before. But each time they got into those stances, it most likely got easier. Same thing with the throw. The more times they catch live pitches and go through the throwing mechanics, the easier it will get to repeat on a consistent basis. The impact of the ball should not be underestimated. And the importance of simply getting the ball out of their glove, out of their hand and into the air should be something that is hammered home each and every rep during the drill.

Also, at the end of the day, we do have to realize that these girls are still 9 and 10 years old. As long as they are using solid mechanics during their game-throws, actually throwing runners out literally means nothing to me until they are 14. At the 10U level, the most important skill these girls can improve on is blocking, hands down. It's great to have a catcher back there who can intimidate the other team with their arm, it is even better to take runs off the opposing scoreboard by blocking everything in the dirt and forcing teams to out hit you in order to win. They are in the process of growing, getting stronger and still learning how to deal with the big round ball flying at them, each year fast than the last. The throws will come in time.


Please don't hesitate to get in touch with me if you have any other questions. Jay@catchingcamp.com. Like Gordo said, it might take me a day or so to respond, with our road trip season starting here in a week, but I try to make sure I get back to everyone who e-mails me within a couple days, if not much sooner. I too consider every catcher, coach or parent who subscribes to our way of teaching catching a personal student of the camp.


Take care.
 

Greenmonsters

Wannabe Duck Boat Owner
Feb 21, 2009
6,165
38
New England
Jay's the expert so I'll just note that the way for them to improve is the same way one get's to Carnegie Hall - practice, practice, practice (under conditions as close to game conditions as possible, i.e., regular pitch or hard front toss)
 

Greenmonsters

Wannabe Duck Boat Owner
Feb 21, 2009
6,165
38
New England
I agree with the posts in here that talk about how the girls may just need more time. They may need to start the move earlier (before they actually catch the ball). Get them to start turning the front side (left knee, left shoulder) to the pitch before they catch it. This will speed up their feet as well as their hands to get rid of the ball.

They probably do this well in their drills because they have more time to get it in. When catching a pitched ball to throw to second, the catcher must start the action before they catch the ball. If they don't they will be too late and the rhythm of the throw will be off.

I believe Jay more than adequately addressed this in a prior post. In less technical terms, IMO, the key is to get the back foot perpendicular to the throw line BEFORE you begin the clockwise hip rotation (RH thrower). This move is the equivalent of the coil or load being discussed in the tech hitting front hip thread. This small change leads to a seeminly effortless but significant increase in velocity and creates a much more linear, down to the bag trajectory.
 
Thanks Jay for the information. It is very helpful. One of the other coaches tried to get the catchers to turn a little and "cheat". I knew deep down this was wrong but didn't have a real reason why. Now I do.

On a side note, we did see that blocking is a very important aspect of the game at 10u. We lost a game 6-0 and not a single person on the team hit the ball! Two of our catchers caught that game. They know the technique of how to block but haven't really tried one in a game. Dont know why but I think it is because they do not know when to block and when not to. Need to work with them on pitch recognition. I felt so bad for the catchers. The other coaches and parents weren't to happy. I talked with them about blocking and how to play passed balls. They all could tell and show me what to do. Just in those moments of screaming parents they had a brain fart and went back to their old ways. It was a real good teaching moment though. All of the catchers realized why we turn glove side on a passed ball now. They got back to the ball and they were backwards and had to turn around. The look on their face was like hmm this isn't how it worked in practice. LOL

After that game my daughter was put in to catch the next day. I warmed her up as normal and sent her in. I was so nervous after the previous day. Second pitch was in the dirt. My heart just sank and thought oh no another passed ball. Then I saw her drop down and successfully block the ball. This was the first time I had seen any 10u catcher block the ball in all the tournaments we have been in. I almost came out of my seat because I was so happy. In between innings I talked to her and told her I was so proud she blocked the ball. I think that first block was the barrier because she executed 8 more perfect blocks saving 3 runs! She only let one passed ball go by in two games. The ball hit the plate and squirted left of where she dropped. She was upset she didn't block that one but I didn't care because of all the others she blocked previously. The umpire also told her she was the best catcher he had seen at 10u for awhile. She lit up so much when he said that.

Now we just need to get past that barrier with the other catchers!

None of this couldn't have been done without the help of the folks at NECC.
 
Jun 24, 2011
32
0
ok... my response is not going to be technical in nature because I coach catchers on my daughters travel team and I see this all of the time. You get a 10U catcher that does well in practice but in live action she does not do as well. Some of the issues you face could be mental ones. I have had a catcher who in practice would drill the all to 2nd and during the game... lob the ball. I sat down with her and ask why ... she was afraid she was going to hit the baserunner. Now I am not saying that is your issue but girls are different then boys and they think ALOT different then boys. It could be something as simple as the ump is crowding her, she is afraid she will hit the batter ... who knows... ask the questions, she may give you the answer. Just my .02 worth.
 
Jul 10, 2011
146
18
Rockport, MA
It's funny you mentioned that situation. We had a student a few years ago who was going through the same thing. She was actually waiting/pausing during her throw to 2B in games. However, her throws in a training environment were incredible. Some of the best we had ever timed at that age. We eventually found out that she was so afraid the she was going to hit her pitcher that she would hold onto the ball until her pitcher cleared out of the way, haha. We sat her down and told her that if the pitcher ends up taking a ball to her teeth it was her own fault for not getting out of the way and that her job was to get rid of it as quickly as she can. She smiled and after the next game she played her dad called us and let us know that she threw out all 4 girls who tried to steal 2B.

It can be a lot of different variables, some that we may not even think of at that moment. The key is not to assume anything and make sure you have all the bases covered when attempting to diagnose the issue. Mechanics can be only one part of the problem indeed.
 

Jim

Apr 24, 2011
389
0
Ohio
I believe Jay more than adequately addressed this in a prior post. In less technical terms, IMO, the key is to get the back foot perpendicular to the throw line BEFORE you begin the clockwise hip rotation (RH thrower). This move is the equivalent of the coil or load being discussed in the tech hitting front hip thread. This small change leads to a seeminly effortless but significant increase in velocity and creates a much more linear, down to the bag trajectory.

That is nearly impossible to do. You need to start rotating before your right foot even leaves the ground. (although it is not a massive turn the "slight turn" starts early.)

 
Last edited:
It's funny you mentioned that situation. We had a student a few years ago who was going through the same thing. She was actually waiting/pausing during her throw to 2B in games. However, her throws in a training environment were incredible. Some of the best we had ever timed at that age. We eventually found out that she was so afraid the she was going to hit her pitcher that she would hold onto the ball until her pitcher cleared out of the way, haha. We sat her down and told her that if the pitcher ends up taking a ball to her teeth it was her own fault for not getting out of the way and that her job was to get rid of it as quickly as she can. She smiled and after the next game she played her dad called us and let us know that she threw out all 4 girls who tried to steal 2B.

It can be a lot of different variables, some that we may not even think of at that moment. The key is not to assume anything and make sure you have all the bases covered when attempting to diagnose the issue. Mechanics can be only one part of the problem indeed.

My daughter said the exact same thing yesterday. I told her the exact same story. Yet she didn't want to hit her friend. LOL. I explained to the pitcher that hey the catcher is going to throw and you need to get out of the way. They started moving :)
 

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