Hips open or closed?

[shaker1]

Paige Lowary, Oklahoma

 

[Jday]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ZB8Lt-JPIA

https://youtu.be/5ZB8Lt-JPIA

It is almost open in air start closing right before landing. But she looks way more open then most pitchers. Front side resistance but lets her top half move forward. She has some serious explosive start power. Don't know how to make this a gif. Sorry.

 

[marriard]

I have always wondered on some of these threads whether some of these movements being stressed are just because they have to happen due to the nature of just the basic motion.

If you open up to 45 degrees, and bring you arm around and throw hard towards a catcher you are going to get a level of hip closure and movement. Your hips HAVE to go somewhere. Does it add to the pitch or are the hips just along for the ride? Probably? Maybe? I am just not sure it is causal or just a sign of a good pitcher doing other things well like excellent front side resistance where there is a much clearer correlation to speed.

Is it worth extra training on? I am not sure - it feels like your add to velocity in this area maybe more of a core strength capability over something I would probably concentrate on in practice.

 

[shaker1]

I am not sure how to double quote here but I want to bump this thread and quote JAD and Coach James. JAD's was posted above on the 2nd reply and quoting Coach J here. Snap the hip partially is bolded.

I have seen many recent questions regarding help increasing velocity for your DD. So many are focused on drive, drive, drive. Yes, drive is important and no doubt about it. But, IMHO, the overlooked mechanic on this site is Hip Snap or HIP TORQUE. IMHO, it is many times what is missing in so many posters on this site and I rarely see comments suggesting this is the missing component. I wish it was discussed more but it is not.

I would STRONGLY recommend looking at the Front Side Resistance sticky which ironically is the least replied or viewed sticky of them all. And...by the way, it was started by probably the best of the best, Rick Pauly. BM, you are right there as well IMO!

I think Rick's suggestions on the importance of Hip Snap, Hip Torque were unfortunately refuted early in the thread and therefore people stayed away. Java, I love him to death, questioned Rick on Hip Snap, Hip Torque in a very sincere way and that did not help on this topic. Java, I am not calling you out because you are also a Pitching GURU and have my utmost respect but I think it hurt the focus on this important piece in my opinion. I know it did for me until awhile back. Full Disclosure, Java has helped with our drive in so many ways over the years and I am forever grateful. Rick has taken my personal emails as well and given incredible advice. Both are amazing and thus my excitement for the kickoff of their website and program.

I would also encourage anyone interested in this and looking for velocity to look at Cat Osterman's Olympic No Hitter (see Youtube) and focus on her hip snap. Watch Monica, watch Ueno, the best of the best and then try it yourself. You will see how important it really is and then you might ask yourself why more people are not talking about it.

Lastly, Rick has an amazing video on this. Google it or Youtube it. He mentions it is one of the secrets to velocity. IT IS! Start watching the hips on the best of the best and it will amaze you. NO, we are not talking about shutting or slamming the door! We are talking about Hip Snap or Hip Torque. It is powerful and chances are you are not focused on it! You are focused on driving and IR but leaving the middle part of your body untrained.

IMHO, you can have an amazing drive, and amazing IR, but still not reach what you are capable of. Why? Because Hip snap brings the legs and arms together (maybe not the best way to state it but that is what is coming to me now).

I am sure I will get some pushback on this post but I really think for many this is the missing ingredient and I hope it helps at least one person out there. BM has a student from years ago that he posted and on his youtube site. She is amazing and her hip snap is insane.

Again, look at the hip snap on the best and perhaps it will help.

S3

Here's my 2 cents. Hip snap is a controlled move, energy comes from the landing and moves up the chain. Some pitchers control the move better than others. But I don't think you actively snap the hip at just the right second, I believe it's more that you hold (resist) the energy you already have from the landing and allow it to be moved up the chain through adduction of the rear leg, timed with the arm. Everything pulls in together. I think it's more that you time when you release the energy rather than your exerting the energy to make it happen, if that makes sense to anyone??

 

[STRIKE3]

Shaker - I should have recognized it was Lowary. Arrgh! Thanks for posting and I agree she has less than others. I was re-watching game 1 of the championship against Florida last year on Youtube and at about 15:31 she seems to have a bit more but the vast majority are exactly as you posted. She is a beast on the mound and love to watch her throw.

 

[STRIKE3]

Marriard and Shaker - Thanks for adding to the thread. Good stuff and great thoughts and observations. Perhaps I should add Hip Stop after Hip Snap and how the 2 work together.

I know I can pitch a softball without any focus on my core and snapping/stopping my hips and it is fairly decent. I would call this casual hips meaning they do their own thing and they finish in the right place regardless.

I can then "focus" on my core and a violent snap then stop and the pitch velocity is visibly different (in a good way!).

Perhaps it works for some pitchers or it just appears it is what is going on when in reality it is very casual and a no teach. I only believe it to be an "adder" from personal experience and after listening (reading/watching) Rick talk about it the last few years.

I love the discussion and thoughts nonetheless!

 

[STRIKE3]

I think the thread below goes well with the discussion. Perhaps those interested will find this helpful as well.

https://www.discussfastpitch.com/softball-pitching/16837-four-points-resistance-pitching.html

On a side note, the Kajikawa Classic kicks off on Flo in a little over an hour!!

 

[coach james]

Does anyone believe it's an actual deliberate hip snap, or is it simply a result of the front hips ball of the femur sinking deep into the socket and then acting as a pivot point during resistance, and what we're seeing is actually the hear hip rotating around the front axis a bit?

 

[Tatonka]

Great video (lots of teaching points in there) and thank you Strike3 for the link to that other discussion...perfect timing! Off to find out if Rick ever started that thread about Acceleration and Deceleration.

 

[STRIKE3]

Does anyone believe it's an actual deliberate hip snap, or is it simply a result of the front hips ball of the femur sinking deep into the socket and then acting as a pivot point during resistance, and what we're seeing is actually the hear hip rotating around the front axis a bit?

That's a great way to say it Coach James and your definition of what is happening is right on IMO. I think the question you posed and I pose as well is if it is deliberate or just a result. Maybe the stop is more deliberate than the snap. Maybe not but when I look at some of the elite their hips/core/leg adduction seem to be doing something deliberate compared to others.

Thanks for your input as always!