Help with Bullet Spin

[WillyT812]

Okay gurus of gurus, my IR1 has a bullet spin problem. We line up the middle finger with the stripe yet, from what I can tell, she's letting the ball roll off the side of the pointer finger as she comes through release. I'll post her first and then me. We're just throwing underhand, no real power, just light tossing trying to get the stripe at a 11-5.

 

[WillyT812]

Now here's me throwing a 11 to 5 spin.

 

[GatorGirl]

Buy the coaches eye app so you can put you both side by side on the screen and show her the difference at the exact same point of release. That might help her see it.

 

[Rick Pauly]

WillyT
Check out the pics below. The one on the left is your student.....are you certain she is gripping the ball with the middle finger on the tape...it certainly does not appear that way. When I watch the video she is actually getting about a 10/4 spin direction. The ball definitely appears to come off the outside of the index finger (aka riseball)...is this the young lady who has been working on the riseball? It may be "bleeding" into her drop action.
The pic on the right is your release.....you certainly are doing a better job of getting the four seam grip with the middle finger on the tape.
I had posted a "crossfire" drill in an earlier post.....this would help get a more true 12/6 spin. I'll see if I can get it up again.

 

[WillyT812]

Hey GatorGirl, I got the Coaches' Eye, great app. I'll do just that, upload and do a sync'd side-by-side comparison. I'd still like a few expert opinions though.

 

[WillyT812]

Thanks Rick, this is Megann pitching. No rise ball work yet. We've been trying to rid her of the bullet spin for almost a month now. I went back to just underhand toss and she's still bullet spinning the ball. I checked her grip before we shot this clip and it was spot on. I can't but help think she's just letting it roll off the side of her hand as she comes through. Maybe one day she'll be the greatest rise ball pitcher ever...wink. But for today, and the upcoming season, her bread and butter pitch needs to be the fast/drop ball. I should have taken one from behind at release as well. Next time.

 

[Doug Romrell]

I'm NO guru of gurus, but in clip 1 it looks like she closes her hips too much just prior to release, and her hand isn't rotated enough at the moment of release--her fingers are really pushing up on the inside of the ball at release.

Clip 2... looks like you are trying to avoid your hip with the inside of your upper forearm. Why? I think your arm is bent too far forward (at elbow) at release. That is, I think you are internally rotating too early, probably due to trying more to muscle the ball a bit.

Just my opinion.

 

[WillyT812]

Thanks Doug, in both clips we're just underhand tossing versus really whipping with IR. I should take and post a video of me whipping and using IR at 1200fps. I've actually got the whip down pretty good. I've noticed one can IR without whip but it's dang near impossible to whip with out using IR. I've got video of some straight arm IR hello elbow pitchers. But there aren't any videos of a girl using whip who aren't also using IR. Whip and IR go together like Forrest and Jenny.

 

[Doug Romrell]

Thanks Doug, in both clips we're just underhand tossing versus really whipping with IR. I should take and post a video of me whipping and using IR at 1200fps. I've actually got the whip down pretty good. I've noticed one can IR without whip but it's dang near impossible to whip with out using IR. I've got video of some straight arm IR hello elbow pitchers. But there aren't any videos of a girl using whip who aren't also using IR. Whip and IR go together like Forrest and Jenny.

Willy, I think you may have misunderstood. Even if you're just underhand tossing, and even if you are getting IR, I think you're doing as I described in my first post--you are trying to avoid your hip with the inside of your upper forearm. Why avoid the hip in this drill? I think your arm is bent too far forward (at elbow) at release. That is, I think you are internally rotating too early.... JMO

 

[WillyT812]

Doug, you're right. In this clip I have slow lazy IR. Tomorrow I'll shoot a clip of me really whipping a pitch. I'm just a hack though, I'll never leap, just trying to help the girls see what a proper spinning ball looks like coming at them. In the first clip you can see her rotation is much tighter than mine, she holds the load (stored energy) much longer than I do. My guess is the longer your can hold the ball facing third and still release before the inner thigh the better. This is a tight IR and is done much more easily when a lot more force/whip is used versus what you see me and Megann doing.

Had to edit second clip to first clip.