Finish flat or finish high?

[CycloneSoftball22]

While I appreciate the gifs, I'm not sold on the thought of a softball swing being the same as a baseball swing. The reason the baseball swing has a steep upward arc is because of the physics involved in the pitching process. A pitcher, standing on a mound (which is 10" higher than the playing field), throws the ball overhand (approximately 2.5' higher than a softball pitcher throws) and the ball has a downward trajectory. Furthermore, offspeed pitches in baseball break down, increasing the degree of slope the batter is facing. Softball's offspeed pitches may break down, but may also rise, but in any case the ball is coming from about 3.5" lower than a pitched baseball. Using the same swing in both instances just doesn't make any sense.

I took my daughter to a hitting clinic at our university a couple years ago and the coaches were telling her things a little different than I had been teaching, so afterwards I asked the coach about what she was teaching and told her what I had been teaching at the time (essentially rotational hitting which I learned from a baseball coach). She looked at me with a pained expression when I said "squash the bug" and said, "umm...ya....don't do that. Baseball and softball swings are different."

About that time, I bought a couple books on softball. To make sure I wasn't mixing things up, I just pulled out Michelle Smith's "Coaches guide to Game Winning Softball Drills." Pg. 103: "Youth softball coaches often admonish their players to make a level swing when hitting the ball. A level swing starts with the bat in the proper launch mode (above the strike zone_ and is executed by swinging the bat down so that the bat is parallel to the ground and on the same plane as the ball. However, to compensate for the upward trajectory of most underhand pitches, the plane of the swing as the bat hits the ball is slightly downward. Keeping the bat in this power plane will help generate line drives. The downward power plane for fast-pitch softball contrasts with the slight upward motion for baseball; baseball's slightly upward power plane compensates fo the generally downward trajectory of a hardball dealt from a raised pitching mound."
I know this may come off as snippy, but it isn't meant to be.

Neither baseball players or softball players want to "squish the bug"

 

[Osric]

that was your takeaway?

 

[CycloneSoftball22]

that was your takeaway?

That was just something that really jumped out at me

 

[lhowser]

With a good swing there really is no such thing as an uppercut - that is the hands getting below the ball and swinging up hoping to meet it.

What I see is a swing where the hands stay above the ball unless the pitch is a riser or high fast ball and letter high (at this point the hands may be level with the ball and the batter may swing almost level on plane)

All other pitches the bat will preferably make contact ARCING upward if timed correctly and if your intention is to drive the ball over the infield and potentially over the outfield.

Some perspective to consider:

average pitch released about 24" from ground.

bottom of strike zone about 18" from ground

top of strike zone about 46" from ground

Somehow hands have to be about 22" from ball to hit the sweet spot of the bat

bat should preferably somwhat trace plane of pitch to hit the ball cleanly and not with a glancing blow

Figure the rest out from there...

 

[redhotcoach]

While I appreciate the gifs, I'm not sold on the thought of a softball swing being the same as a baseball swing. The reason the baseball swing has a steep upward arc is because of the physics involved in the pitching process. A pitcher, standing on a mound (which is 10" higher than the playing field), throws the ball overhand (approximately 2.5' higher than a softball pitcher throws) and the ball has a downward trajectory. Furthermore, offspeed pitches in baseball break down, increasing the degree of slope the batter is facing. Softball's offspeed pitches may break down, but may also rise, but in any case the ball is coming from about 3.5" lower than a pitched baseball. Using the same swing in both instances just doesn't make any sense.

I took my daughter to a hitting clinic at our university a couple years ago and the coaches were telling her things a little different than I had been teaching, so afterwards I asked the coach about what she was teaching and told her what I had been teaching at the time (essentially rotational hitting which I learned from a baseball coach). She looked at me with a pained expression when I said "squash the bug" and said, "umm...ya....don't do that. Baseball and softball swings are different."

About that time, I bought a couple books on softball. To make sure I wasn't mixing things up, I just pulled out Michelle Smith's "Coaches guide to Game Winning Softball Drills." Pg. 103: "Youth softball coaches often admonish their players to make a level swing when hitting the ball. A level swing starts with the bat in the proper launch mode (above the strike zone_ and is executed by swinging the bat down so that the bat is parallel to the ground and on the same plane as the ball. However, to compensate for the upward trajectory of most underhand pitches, the plane of the swing as the bat hits the ball is slightly downward. Keeping the bat in this power plane will help generate line drives. The downward power plane for fast-pitch softball contrasts with the slight upward motion for baseball; baseball's slightly upward power plane compensates fo the generally downward trajectory of a hardball dealt from a raised pitching mound."

I know this may come off as snippy, but it isn't meant to be.

I am not getting going to figure the complete math. I did that once on here somewhere. Real basic angles. Simple math...close but definitely not exact.
Say baseball pitcher and softball pitcher. Both throwing a strike at 3 feet over home plate. Softball...for easy figuring we will say she releases at 3 feet above the field. Say it is a perfectly flat throw (they are not...almost all softball pitches will rise and drop, very very few pitchers can throw a rise ball that rises). So the angle that is coming in is 0 degrees.

Baseball pitcher. We will say they release at 60 feet (I know they get closer, but to keep simple). We will say they release at 8 feet above the playing field (just a guess). The target is 3 feet, so release point is 5 feet above target, 60 feet away. Say it is a flat throw (yes they too drop not flat, but keeping it simple). The angle of a baseball pitch coming from 8 feet high, 60 feet away, to a target 3 feet high is 4.76 degrees. Not much difference...I would venture to say the last 10 feet or so in the real world are even closer to the same angle.

 

[mann]

Osric, you are not alone, 95% of the coaches in my area think, feel, just the same as you do.
Perhaps you can think about this, Even if the ball was rising, which it is not,( not for strike anyway ) WHY would you swing DOWN on a ball coming up????? IT WOULD GO DOWN.

The major league swing is as short as a swing can be. It generates power, and assures more contact, with adjustabilty, than the swing Michelle talks about. Strangely enough, look at some recent swings of hers, Ashley Charters must be giving her some tips.

 

[mann]

Hum, seems like Michelle Smith has been listening to you Osric.

Softball Drill: How to Properly Hit a Softball with Michele Smith - YouTube. Its no wonder why its so hard to get everyone on the same page

 

[2bucketdad]

While Michelle Smith was and is a great player, unless I am mistaken her batting average was something like .177.

And the last I checked Bustos doesn't give pitching lessons...just saying...

 

[rdbass]

 

[softballphreak]

While Michelle Smith was and is a great player, unless I am mistaken her batting average was something like .177.

And the last I checked Bustos doesn't give pitching lessons...just saying...

Michele does have a hitting video. And it is much longer than Bustos' video. As far as the BA, I doubt many of the posters on here can bat much better than Michele in actual competition.

PS: Not commenting on the quality of the instruction.