How important are stats?

[julray]

Knowing an opposing hitter's tendencies isn't really considered a statistic. If the OP had asked the question "Is it important to know if another team's 4 hole hitter can hit a changeup" I doubt the thread would have gone this long..

How do you truly know an opposing hitters tendency? Based off what the coach sees or based on what they have on paper? What would be more dependable info? How about if the hitter is a pull hitter..? Slapper? Threat to steal? ETC ETC. Unless you are playing the same team day in day out you are guessing. Where a hitter hits the ball, what pitch they hit well vs what they don't are statistics! The thread shouldn't be this long, statistics are useful, they can help a coach make decisions without bias and favoritism. Of course the coach needs to buy in as well.

Hitters tendencies AKA trends are based off statistical data.

 

[_MIA_]

How do you truly know an opposing hitters tendency? Based off what the coach sees or based on what they have on paper? What would be more dependable info? How about if the hitter is a pull hitter..? Slapper? Threat to steal? ETC ETC. Unless you are playing the same team day in day out you are guessing. Where a hitter hits the ball, what pitch they hit well vs what they don't are statistics! The thread shouldn't be this long, statistics are useful, they can help a coach make decisions without bias and favoritism. Of course the coach needs to buy in as well.

Hitters tendencies AKA trends are based off statistical data.

Unless I misunderstood your example, they had somebody come scout your team before you played them? In which case they saw your team play what, 1 or 2 times. In this case whatever "statistics" (used in the true sense of the word) they gathered were useless. Now if instead they were able to somehow pull spray charts, pitching charts, etc from some database which included all your games (in which case I suggest you make that private from now on ) , then that is a different story.

If it was my first scenario, e.g. an "advanced scout", what wasn't useless was the scouts knowledge bank (which really is huge collection of information, e.g. a large sample size) which allowed him/her to be able gather information on a player (without resorting to statistical metrics) and know what sort of hitter they probably were based upon 5 to 10 swings,etc.

 

[MNDad]

How do you truly know an opposing hitters tendency? Based off what the coach sees or based on what they have on paper? What would be more dependable info? How about if the hitter is a pull hitter..? Slapper? Threat to steal? ETC ETC. Unless you are playing the same team day in day out you are guessing. Where a hitter hits the ball, what pitch they hit well vs what they don't are statistics! The thread shouldn't be this long, statistics are useful, they can help a coach make decisions without bias and favoritism. Of course the coach needs to buy in as well.

Hitters tendencies AKA trends are based off statistical data.

What age level are we talking here? I'd agree that HS age stats can be helpful. I would not say they can be solely or even largely relied upon because they're accuracy isn't very high.

 

[julray]

Unless I misunderstood your example, they had somebody come scout your team before you played them? In which case they saw your team play what, 1 or 2 times. In this case whatever "statistics" (used in the true sense of the word) they gathered were useless. Now if instead they were able to somehow pull spray charts, pitching charts, etc from some database which included all your games (in which case I suggest you make that private from now on ) , then that is a different story.

If it was my first scenario, e.g. an "advanced scout", what wasn't useless was the scouts knowledge bank (which really is huge collection of information, e.g. a large sample size) which allowed him/her to be able gather information on a player (without resorting to statistical metrics) and know what sort of hitter they probably were based upon 5 to 10 swings,etc.

Sample size is key, like I already mentioned. And that goes for developing tendencies as well,...

What age level are we talking here? I'd agree that HS age stats can be helpful. I would not say they can be solely or even largely relied upon because they're accuracy isn't very high.

> u16.. Inaccuracies are apparent in most things.. the lesser of two evils. Coaches biased opinion vs statistical data... If you were to choose how your DD would be evaluated, which would you choose? Of course you may be a coach and we know what the answer would be.

FYI, Stats are not the be all, end all, there are intangible factors as well. I get the feeling most on here who arguing against stats were either a coach or good friends with the coach.

 

[MNDad]

Sample size is key, like I already mentioned. And that goes for developing tendencies as well,...




> u16.. Inaccuracies are apparent in most things.. the lesser of two evils. Coaches biased opinion vs statistical data... If you were to choose how your DD would be evaluated, which would you choose? Of course you may be a coach and we know what the answer would be.

FYI, Stats are not the be all, end all, there are intangible factors as well. I get the feeling most on here who arguing against stats were either a coach or good friends with the coach.

Daughters ERA in conference freshman season was 15+. Yes, fifteen. I’m glad coach didn’t look at stats to judge performance. Lol

Not a coach. Just a Dad. She coaches now so I guess that counts.

 

[Greatdaytobeawildcat]

We (10u team, I was ac, the other ac and hc - all with dd’s on the team) used stats just as a check on what we were doing. Before bigger tournaments we would get together (at local sports bar) and just make sure we were on the same page, and that we weren’t missing something. Other AC kept GC, and she was mostly accurate in my opinion. We only used it for lineup - not for defensive decisions.

Just looked back at our pitching/ catching stats for this summer though...damn we were fair.

Our two catchers (my dd and other ac’s dd):
Innings, 102 / 105, CS, 28/35

Our two primary pitchers:
Innings: 106 / 91, strike %: .539 / .537, P/inn: 1.121 / 1.131, bb/inn: 1.078 / 1.121, SO: 160 / 153

We never used stats to decide who to catch or pitch on any given day, it just worked out that way. Kind of incredible how even it turned out. All 4 kids were great. We did trust the 1st pitcher a little more in big games, but there was always a quick trigger to the other kid (both ways).

 

[dentedshins]

This is exactly what I am talking about!! If a coach will go through the trouble of modifying stats(which can be tracked and controlled by permissions) to support their decision.. just imagine what's going on in their head and with their decision process when there's nothing to hold them in check.

Absolutely, I would never argue for the integrity of a coaches perception. If your kid was slotted in a back up role, most coaches are going to make damn sure that's where she stays. She's going to be called out more harshly and evaluated more critically than the favored starter all season long. Coaches don't like to be proven wrong. That's where I say stats are for parents, because they often present them, or site them, as evidence. But unless they're kept by professional statisticians, I'm very skeptical.

 

[_MIA_]

Absolutely, I would never argue for the integrity of a coaches perception. If your kid was slotted in a back up role, most coaches are going to make damn sure that's where she stays. She's going to be called out more harshly and evaluated more critically than the favored starter all season long. Coaches don't like to be proven wrong. That's where I say stats are for parents, because they often present them, or site them, as evidence. But unless they're kept by professional statisticians, I'm very skeptical.

I would think the motivation to win would outweigh that of being proven wrong..unless of course the coach is playing Daddy ball and one of the persons involved is their DD..

 

[julray]

Daughters ERA in conference freshman season was 15+. Yes, fifteen. I’m glad coach didn’t look at stats to judge performance. Lol

Not a coach. Just a Dad. She coaches now so I guess that counts.

Really? You don't think the coach considered that to judge performance?

 

[Westwind]

Here is another angle... relates to sample size I guess

When dd was 10u, the head coach had dw keep score on an iPad which was fairly cutting edge at the time, lol

We were one of the better teams in the area and had solid pitching. Because dw was diligent about entering names consistently at the end of the year we had stats on other players. Some for several years. When we merged with another team in 12’s, I listed all the new players out by avg, OBP, ops etc and I was surprised to see that some of the players that were regarded as solid players were .250 against us. Guess what.... that didn’t change.

Now keep in mind I was not coaching at the time, I was merely interested in the data and had ready access to it. No coaching decisions were made with the info we had. But.... It really seemed like the stats we had over numerous games against those players was at least somewhat predictive of their performance when they came to our team.

After that, I always hated to see gamechanger or iscore stats of opposing teams entered without a correct name.