coachlisle: stop telling hitters to hit the outside pitch deep

[FiveFrameSwing]

Very good explanation and logic. Thank you FFS. The result of a change in post impact conditions would just be a mishit correct?

Post impact activity helps tell you the quality of impact. The Zepp will help you prove this to yourself.

I can understand the attitude of thinking the swing is over at impact .... but that mentality can be destructive.

Recently Tewks described a "back to home plate" drill ..... the intent being to encourage FP hitters to complete their swing.

 

[coachbob]

If you haven’t been paying attention to MLB’s off-season discussions about speeding up the game, one of the measures considered was banning defensive infield shifts. Without getting into the merits, these shifts, which overload the pull side of the field, are a product of MLB hitters being unable to consistently make quality contact on outside pitches. Given similar scouting resources and reports, the same shifts could be used very effectively in FP softball as most hitters have far fewer problems making quality contact (and pulling) with inside and middle pitches. The great hitters can drive the outside pitch (or are so big and strong that they can pull it consistently!). Bottom line is that I am OK using a drill that exaggerates a concept as a means to a desired end.

At face value, Lisle's “Don’t let the outside pitch get deep” is poor advice. IMO, better universal advice would be – “Let the outside pitch get deep, but not too deep” or, better yet, “let the outside pitch get slightly deeper than a middle pitch, and more deeper than an inside pitch”. But as we know, any cue can be effective as long as the hitter understands its contextual meaning and you can bet that Lisle's hitters know exactly what he means!

Good post.

I actually use a shift with my thumber*. She can hit any spot with three speeds (slow, slower, and much slower). We put a fast 2B in the grass, center and left play very deep, and right shallow left center, behind short. (Btw, don't park your car in the left field lot when she is pitching.) We move them around based on count and runners.

The FP reality (IMO) is that few young girls can really swing a bat that's long enough to get the sweet spot on the ball out front on the outside pitch. Therefore, a half-clever fastpitch coach can create a smaller slice of pie to defend, and call outside pitches all day long. The girls ARE getting bigger and stronger and the bats are getting shaved and rolled, so its not an absolute with every righty; but it's a pretty good policy. Triple threat lefties are the way to go!

I like my kids to hit that corner deeper in, because they hit sweet spot more and might get lucky; otherwise foul ball. Always on a full count or situational condition.

The poster who wrote that the Bustos's tee line is useless is off the mark IMO. The ability to foul off pitches is just one of the high-end batting skills that take practice to all locations. The deep zone outside pitch with a full count is a good example.





*Thumber: a pitcher who, because of a lack of a blazing fastball, uses a variety of offspeed pitches to get hitters out; "rag arm"

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

The poster who wrote that the Bustos's tee line is useless is off the mark IMO. The ability to foul off pitches is just one of the high-end batting skills that take practice to all locations. The deep zone outside pitch with a full count is a good example.

If the best a hitter can do is foul off an outside pitch on a full count, then that's what they will often be served.

 

[chrispots]

It is an interesting discussion. I seem to remember a similar discussion at BBD not too long ago. One of the posters used the vision of an ice skater as a comparison. The tighter the arms to the body, the faster the spin. When reading your post, that vision came to my mind. Just curious what that would do in regards to bat speed. Is bat speed faster on a inside pitch than an outside pitch? I wonder if that is something that could be tested with a Zepp?

I would love to know if the Zepp could measure this...CP

 

[coachbob]

If the best a hitter can do is foul off an outside pitch on a full count, then that's what they will often be served.

Yep, and when my batter jogs to first on the next one, the umpire will probably give it to her.

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

Yep, and when my batter jogs to first on the next one, the umpire will probably give it to her.

I wouldn't count on that. Instead, I'd learn to drive the pitches on the outside edge of the plate fair.

 

[CoogansBluff]

The ability to foul off pitches is just one of the high-end batting skills that take practice to all locations. The deep zone outside pitch with a full count is a good example.

Are you saying that hitters intentionally foul off pitches, and that they practice this skill?

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

Are you saying that hitters intentionally foul off pitches, and that they practice this skill?

Perhaps on a change-up, but in general I tend to believe that the majority of swings are made with the intent to hit the ball fair.

 

[FP26]

Perhaps on a change-up, but in general I tend to believe that the majority of swings are made with the intent to hit the ball fair.

If a hitter is fooled, fouling off a pitch can be a good defense mechanism. But I believe much of that is determined by the hitter's athletic ability and hand/eye coordination. Not sure it is a skill that can be practiced with much success. The timing window is extremely small.

 

[FP26]

Knightsb just posted this in another thread but it seemed valid to this discussion. Go to the 50 to 55 second mark of the video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4uoEO6Cs6w