What to do when the Catcher won't cooperate?

[FiveFrameSwing]

It was interesting to watch the Softball WCWS this year. As I watched the pitchers take the pitch calls from the dugout, I noticed that most girls on some teams are wearing wrist bands to see what pitch is being called. I am guessing that the concept is that if the fielders know what pitch is being called and what location that it is being thrown to, that the fielders will have a better chance of anticipating where the ball may be hit and thus reduce hits and/or errors.

Be careful when using that phase or you too may find yourself in a flame war with FFS over the benefits of the Auburn hop!

Sorry you feel that way. My perspective, and that of the Auburn coaches, is that there is a time for anticipation and a time for using real data such that reactionary skills are tapped into. The notion being not to make false anticipated moves that interfer with reactionary skills.

 

[riseball]

Not sure everyone is ready to drink the Auburn Hop Kool Aid. I guess time will tell. Right now it is nothing more than an interesting footnote.

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

One of the points made in this discussion was that of using catchers that are athletic. Catching is hugely important, and many games are lost simply because of catching that could have been better. One significant advantage to having an athletic catcher comes when a catcher is trained to tap into their reactionary skills.

 

[JAD]

Not sure everyone is ready to drink the Auburn Hop Kool Aid. I guess time will tell. Right now it is nothing more than an interesting footnote.

My contention is that if the hop worked as well as some people claim, every team in MLB would be using it...

 

[riseball]

My contention is that if the hop worked as well as some people claim, every team in MLB would be using it...

At least maybe some other college teams? While it is an interesting theory, the question remains as to the practical application and any tangible benefit. If it were all that, I would have expected the Auburn fielding to trend upward. Only time will tell, but I do not see teams rushing to embrace this next great thing. Would think that the Aussies would jump on it.

 

[MNDad]

There's a B program here that's incorporated the "hop". They haven't quite got the timing down and look like a bunch of jack in the boxes popping off at different times.

 

[Greenmonsters]

I agree 100% that anyone calling pitches could do a better job if they did so from behind the plate. But in the grand scheme of things the incremental value attained simply does not justify the expense of transferring the required knowledge to the catcher. Top level teams put significant effort into scouting other teams, analyzing stats, picking signs and anything else to gain a competitive advantage. Training the catcher to call the game is obviously is not worth the effort. If it was, then coaches would be doing it. The unpopular truth is that "great pitch calling" has a minimal effect over what would be considered competent pitch calling. You do not need great pitch calling, great catching, or even great pitching to be successful. You just need a high level of competency. In other words just don't screw it up. As stated by NECC it is not about turning balls into strikes, rather it is about keeping strikes as strikes. Pitching is similar in that it is not about throwing great pitches, but not throwing it fat. If you have a competent pitcher and catcher and simply do not screw up the pitch calling you will do quite well.

We will have to disagree. I believe the advantage gained is exponential, not incremental. A scouting report is of great value but this isn't fantasy baseball or a video game. The pitch-by-pitch reads on the hitter, umpire, and pitcher are what should determine whether the initial game plan should be adhered to or modified because the hitters also have scouting-based game plans, too! However, it's a guaranteed s*** show if the pitch caller is poor AND/OR the pitcher can't execute consistently!

 

[sleepwalker]

Some of the most painful games that I have watched my dd pitch at the college level were games where the catcher called a steady diet of east and west pitches. Batters that can keep their heads down and see pitch after pitch on the same relative level are going to be able to tee off on a pitch of their choosing.

As a DFP pitcher parent, I believe in teaching my dd to throw on different planes, drop and rise balls, and different speeds, peel drop, roll over and changeup. We teach our dd's to set up their, go-to pitch, with a pitch of contrasting speed or a pitch on a different plane. In other words, we teach our pitcher dd's to be students of the game of softball and not so much robots of a pitch caller, whether she is calling pitches from behind the plate or a coach calling pitches from the dugout. Teaching a pitcher to be a student of the game and a student of the hitter is often in conflict with the wishes of the person calling the game.

In travel ball, a pitcher may be able to shake off pitches and use her skills and knowledge of pitching to attempt to improve her success against a hitter. In college ball, a pitch that is called out of the dugout that a pitcher shakes off, may be the last pitch that the pitcher throws for several games or even the rest of the season. If a pitcher has done her research before playing on a travel ball team or arriving at college, she may have asked about having the opportunity to throw the pitch that she feels is appropriate for the situation at hand. But honestly, how many people ask that question when becoming a guest pitcher for a travel ball team or signing a NLI for a college team?

 

[JAD]

In travel ball, a pitcher may be able to shake off pitches and use her skills and knowledge of pitching to attempt to improve her success against a hitter. In college ball, a pitch that is called out of the dugout that a pitcher shakes off, may be the last pitch that the pitcher throws for several games or even the rest of the season. If a pitcher has done her research before playing on a travel ball team or arriving at college, she may have asked about having the opportunity to throw the pitch that she feels is appropriate for the situation at hand. But honestly, how many people ask that question when becoming a guest pitcher for a travel ball team or signing a NLI for a college team?

There are a BUNCH of TB coaches who think they are a lot smarter than they really are....and it is sad, especially when they are idiots and don't realize it. When I was calling pitches I would always ask the pitcher and catcher what is working and what is not between innings. When we got to 3 balls on a batter I would give a sign to "just throw a strike" and I really do not care what it is, pitchers choice.

 

[Greenmonsters]

There are a BUNCH of TB coaches who think they are a lot smarter than they really are....and it is sad, especially when they are idiots and don't realize it. When I was calling pitches I would always ask the pitcher and catcher what is working and what is not between innings. When we got to 3 balls on a batter I would give a sign to "just throw a strike" and I really do not care what it is, pitchers choice.

IME, it isn't limited to TB coaches