Talent Rules

[morpheus]

My 18 year old DD is a hs senior and has been pitching half of her life. She's a good kid, coachable, nice and eager to please. She works hard, works right, takes pitching lessons and she's topped out with her speed. At 5'8" 137 lbs. no matter what she does, her average fastball is 57mph, and had been for several years. She works out with a softball focused strength and conditioning coach, works on her legs, her leg drive and does long toss, all to no avail. Of course she works on location, change ups and curve, and drop, but a bit more velocity would be nice. She's got an offer from the local community college and that's good, but in the end talent really does rule. Sometimes hard work is enough, sometimes not quite.

 

[starsnuffer]

Somewhere there is another 18 year old senior who was born with long limbs and a high percentage of fast-twice muscle. She has always had speed and easily throws 65mph.

In four years, both this kids, and your daughters softball experience will be over, in spite of how fast they threw.

Your daughter will walk away from that knowing that she gave it her absolute best effort and worked as hard as she could to achieve what she strove for. The other kid will simply walk away.

Your daughter will be able to apply her dedication and work ethic to whatever she chooses, be it her career, her family, a hobby, or a cause. The other kid will be on par with just about every other post-graduate.

Yes, talent rules, but softball is temporary.

-W

 

[Ken B]

morpheus,
First, welcome and thanks for contributing to DFP.

Do you happen to have a decent video of her from the side and relatively close? Like starsnuffer suggested, some kids max at different speeds and that's it. Occassionally, there is a little more there that just hasn't been tapped. Regardless of her speed, maximizing her strengths and using them to target batter's weaknesses is just as important.


Ken

 

[halskinner]

First off, there is no such thing as a pitcher that has topped out on speed. I have proven that hundreds and hundreds of times.

Everyone seems to think speed is only a result of mechanics and strength. IT IS NOT. Ity is as much a mental state of mind as it is physical conditioning.


However, you said she has been stuck at 57mph for years??? If that is actually the case, it may very well be the case of her mechanics holding her back from attaining more speed.

I hope you and the coach have never said she has topped out where she can hear it. If she truly believes that is true, it will be unlikely she pushes it farther than she is. Confidence is everything in pitching, so dont chip away at it.

 

[morpheus]

First off, there is no such thing as a pitcher that has topped out on speed. I have proven that hundreds and hundreds of times.

Everyone seems to think speed is only a result of mechanics and strength. IT IS NOT. Ity is as much a mental state of mind as it is physical conditioning.


However, you said she has been stuck at 57mph for years??? If that is actually the case, it may very well be the case of her mechanics holding her back from attaining more speed.

I hope you and the coach have never said she has topped out where she can hear it. If she truly believes that is true, it will be unlikely she pushes it farther than she is. Confidence is everything in pitching, so dont chip away at it.

No, she has not been told she's topped out, but thank you for your advice. As much as I respect your experience, I do disagree about topping out. In every human endeavor there is a ceiling, pitching is no exception. As a 12 year old, she hit 55, as a skinny freshman she hit 56, the next year 57, and that was that.

We've both watched Hillhouse's video, Kemph's video and countless videos posted by many off you on this site. I've read hundreds of your posts on this site, and been to pitching clinics, pitching coaches and seen in person pitchers like Finch, Abbot, Tincher and Osterman. Sometimes you top out.
And as one poster pointed out, it's only softball. True enough, but still one of the joys in life is maximizing your potential. This is a great forum with many helpful posters, thank you all of that.

Note to Hal, if you can increase her speed by 3mph I'll make a sizable donation to a charity of your choice. Someone asked about videos. I'm not comfortable posting them, but here are some pics that provide some clarity.

 

[splinterpicker]

Do you have any pic of her motion from the rubber? She has a big stride and I am curious if she is using her legs or just taking a big step. I am a fan of a pitcher using legs, arm speed and spinning the heck out of the ball. Also would be a help to be able to see her finishes after the pitch.

 

[halskinner]

Morpheus,

check your private messages.

Hal

 

[Jojo]

Morpheus, I know what you are talking about, I've seen very large 10yr olds that threw 50+, I remember one that was throwing 55 and my DD and her shared the same PC. Her PC said she was going to be an Olympian one day. She was like 5'5" at 10yrs old and heavily built. I didn't see her again until they played against each other in high school play-offs, she was probably just 5'7" then and throwing 57. People used to say she "topped out" at 10, being such a monster, but by 16 she was just average.

I've seen several of those types over the years, being just brutes at 10u, only to be average by high school.

I wouldn't call it, "talent", more or less but genetics.

My own DD was always averaged sized, but above average in speed, she never topped out, always gained at least a mile per hour a year even in college, and in college there was no tweaking of mechanics, just probably increased weight training and feeling her body better--more stable, dealing less with the body growth spurts.

I do feel a few mphs can be tweaked out depending on the size of the pitcher.
I don't know anything about your DD's mechanics, work ethics, workouts, and mentality, but I'm sure there is something that can be adjusted.

And don't knock the local CC, she can end up in a really nice university after her freshman/sophomore year.

 

[Ken B]

Do you have any pic of her motion from the rubber? She has a big stride and I am curious if she is using her legs or just taking a big step. I am a fan of a pitcher using legs, arm speed and spinning the heck out of the ball. Also would be a help to be able to see her finishes after the pitch.

Or shots from the other side showing 9, 7 and 5 o'clock?

 

[TouchMint]

Somewhere there is another 18 year old senior who was born with long limbs and a high percentage of fast-twice muscle. She has always had speed and easily throws 65mph.

In four years, both this kids, and your daughters softball experience will be over, in spite of how fast they threw.

Your daughter will walk away from that knowing that she gave it her absolute best effort and worked as hard as she could to achieve what she strove for. The other kid will simply walk away.

Your daughter will be able to apply her dedication and work ethic to whatever she chooses, be it her career, her family, a hobby, or a cause. The other kid will be on par with just about every other post-graduate.

Yes, talent rules, but softball is temporary.

-W

Very very well said!