If that kid is playing for me I am most likely putting her on the bench. There is no reason for that if it truly was intentional!!!
Opponent blocking the bases....
- Thread starter BaldNBeautiful
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- Mar 1, 2013
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A pointed (but respectful) question to ask the umpire:
"Blue, the fielder without the ball and not in the act of fielding a batted ball hindered my runner. Isn't that obstruction?"
Now, if the ump answers along the lines of, "In my judgement, the runner was not impeded by the defender" or "I'm sorry, I didn't see it" then you just have to take it. But if the answer is along the lines of, "Yes, but there was no contact" then your next statement should be, "Blue, we are playing under protest."
I am just going to have to work the Umpires better, before and during the game.
Unfortunately we are not permitted to Protest or play under protest in our school ball.
Thanks everyone.
Unfortunately we are not permitted to Protest or play under protest in our school ball.
Thanks everyone.
Again the issue is what do you do when umpires simply don't know the rule or chose not to enforce it correctly. We are not allowed to play under protest either, until sectionals/regionals and nationals. and if you think playing under protest solves anything the answer is usually "no", ultimately contact or no the umpire can still say the non-contact in his judgement still did not rise to the level of obstruction blah, blah, blah.
OK sorry to derail the thread with a poor example/video and while I am harsh on umps especially in these chronic area where they seem to not be willing to apply the rule correctly...I wore the blue for about three years and understand it is a lot harder than it looks.
- Mar 1, 2013
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If you're denied the right to play under protest, your only course is to play and then take it up the chain. Everyone has a UIC. Ask for a meeting and go from there. UIC's like to know if guys they have working for them aren't doing their jobs correctly. Trust me, when I have made some mistakes out there, my UIC wasn't shy about letting me know - not to berate me, but to correct the problem.
No matter what, though, the answer is NOT to coach your girls to initiate contact.
No matter what, though, the answer is NOT to coach your girls to initiate contact.
Greenmonsters
Wannabe Duck Boat Owner
I find it somewhat amusing that blocking the base path isn't an issue in baseball. Regardless of whether it's coached or not, the 1B clears the bag pretty quickly when there's no play there. IMO, its normally because they a) learn the hard way after getting dumped on their butt ONCE and b) historically they have to worry about metal spikes at a younger age. The other infielders don't usually have to learn that lesson personally.
And, yes, IMO and IME, there are SB coaches that do coach and take advantage of the fact that most younger girls will usually try to avoid contact.
And, IMO FWIW, with respect to the video above, #17 should have been ejected (or benched by the coach if not ejected).
And, yes, IMO and IME, there are SB coaches that do coach and take advantage of the fact that most younger girls will usually try to avoid contact.
And, IMO FWIW, with respect to the video above, #17 should have been ejected (or benched by the coach if not ejected).
I think I am just looking for a practical solution, if you can't get a call for obstruction without contact, but you teach your girls to run around players in the base path so as not to initiate contact and they keep getting called out the only practical solution is if you think it might be a closer play and the fielder is on the base path run back to the bag and don't try to advance....that does not seem like much of any answer, after all isn't it the defender who is initiating contact by standing in the base path.
- Mar 1, 2013
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Your practical solution is to take it up the chain. If you consistently get umpires who don't/won't apply the obstruction/interference rules, then the UIC should be made aware. He/she will probably make sure to pay a visit to games these guys are working to see what's going on.
You can certainly coach your girls to make the turns as tight as they need to without initiating a major collision like the one in the video posted. Have them make a show of it if you're not getting the calls. "C'mon 1st, you're in the way!" or "Out of my base path!" as she rounds. However, if the umpires aren't going to call it, they won't call it. As noted, take that information up the chain.
And, honestly, your statement that the defender is initiating contact by standing in the base path is like my saying that the car parked in the intersection was at fault when I rammed into it, even though I saw it and had plenty of time to avoid it. That's just arguing for the sake of arguing.
But so you can hear me say that you are correct - if her presence (without the ball) in the runner's chosen base path is causing the runner to alter her course (slow down, turn, retreat, etc.) then OBS should be called.
You can certainly coach your girls to make the turns as tight as they need to without initiating a major collision like the one in the video posted. Have them make a show of it if you're not getting the calls. "C'mon 1st, you're in the way!" or "Out of my base path!" as she rounds. However, if the umpires aren't going to call it, they won't call it. As noted, take that information up the chain.
And, honestly, your statement that the defender is initiating contact by standing in the base path is like my saying that the car parked in the intersection was at fault when I rammed into it, even though I saw it and had plenty of time to avoid it. That's just arguing for the sake of arguing.
But so you can hear me say that you are correct - if her presence (without the ball) in the runner's chosen base path is causing the runner to alter her course (slow down, turn, retreat, etc.) then OBS should be called.
I have to chime in with an example and question. HS BB game many yrs ago. Opposing player hit a pop up mile high short right field. 1st and RF converge on ball no one calls it last second RF trys to make catch and pops down off the heel of glove. The runner slides into 3rd beating the trow from rt field. Rt fielder never thought about someone "running out a pop up to 3rd" and got caught by surprise. Our coach calls time steps onto the field points to runner on 3rd yelling at us about what hustle is and that was a prime example. Now if there had been a defender either first or second in the base path and the runner flattened him should he have been ejected or awarded the next base for obstrucstion. I will say that I never ever teach or want it taught to hurt someone just because you can, but I also teach when running bases do not run around defense "watching" the game and I teach my defense that the other coach teachs the same so get out of baseline "If you dont have a play you have some where to be backing up where the play is".
Sometimes in this game, players just happen to be in the vicinity of other players. It's the nature of the beast and sometimes it leads to contact.
Not all contact is illegal contact. But if a player goes out of her way to initiate it, when it was otherwise unavoidable, and the contact is either flagrant, excessive or malicious, the player initiating it deserves to be ejected.
Saying that a player purposely running into another is doing something illegal isn't just a warm and fuzzy feel good comment. By rule, if an obstructed runner commits interference or illegal contact, the interference or illegal contact supercedes the obstruction call. Just because you're obstructed, it doesn't give you free reign to knock the fielder into next week.
Not all contact is illegal contact. But if a player goes out of her way to initiate it, when it was otherwise unavoidable, and the contact is either flagrant, excessive or malicious, the player initiating it deserves to be ejected.
Saying that a player purposely running into another is doing something illegal isn't just a warm and fuzzy feel good comment. By rule, if an obstructed runner commits interference or illegal contact, the interference or illegal contact supercedes the obstruction call. Just because you're obstructed, it doesn't give you free reign to knock the fielder into next week.
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