How to fix elbows leading the hands at connection?

[lhowser]

Wellphyt says in post #36

By standing in front of a mirror with a bat in hand, I was able to figured out how to lower my back elbow to get my hands flat, without moving my hands down or forward. The hands basically stay in one place and stay perfectly connected to the shoulder.... Once you get comfortable with that movement, start adding in shoulder tilt and rotation, while picturing in your minds eye the barrell of the bat arcing around towards contact.... If you do it correctly.....

Thanks for taking the time and effort on post #36. I've got to say I'm not getting it yet. Anything you can add in terms of video would be awesome but I appreciate this post. It is the type of detail that is truely beneficial much like BoardMembers decription of Internal Rotation is pitching. Thanks much.

 

[bosoxfan]

This may be a really basic question but what do you mean by getting the hands flat?

Does it mean palm up palm down on a plane parrell to the ground?

 

[tom.guerry]

see torques and flat palm hitting info from Epstein copied in post #13 here:

- HITTING DRILL - RHD

 

[Tewks]

Getting the hands flat correctly/early, simplifies the entire swing and is very easy to teach. The kids love it because it's not a forced movement. It frees them up to swing the bat. The only thing I'm telling my daughter now is to "get the bat started correctly".

Correct me if I'm wrong, but this is getting the hands flat:
DiscussFastpitch.com - A.B. Athletic Development, LLC

And it could be done better.

 

[Wellphyt]

Chris, I really enjoyed your response to my post. I tried to respond in kind. My responses are in bold. Thanks for the exchange, it's been fun.

Good hitters set up assuming middle middle and adjust from there.

That gives them the shortest distance to adjust to any pitch.

I agree with Slaught when he says that the body is designed to work from the inside out and if a hitter is prepared to hit the pitch up and in then they can more easily adjust to the pitch down and away by naturally releasing the angles in the elbows and wrist.



I don't have a problem with a running start because it can help deal with the problem of inertia.




So in other words your daughter commits too soon and is vulnerable to changing speeds.

This a common mistake that is made by people who don't understand the concept of early bat speed/getting the hands flat quickly. Perhaps this will help you understand it better YouTube - Baseball Hitting Instruction by Don Slaught - The Decision to Swing

One disagreement I have with Slaught here is his statement that the swing starts when the back elbow begins to lower. I believe it is more accurate to say that the lowering of the back elbow starts the rearward arc of the barrell. IMO, the actual swing as defined by "GO" or "the point of no return", occurs later. Admittingly I am probably splitting hairs.


The alternative is to slowly sweep the bat head up to speed, which works up until maybe HS.

See the above Slaught link.


And if she's ealy she's SOL.

See the above Slaught link.


You're confusing cause and effect.

If the bat is glued to her back shoulder, which is indeed good, then that's because everything is turning with her shoulders.

I'm not confusing anything. I've taken hundreds of swings and understand completely what I'm doing. The best way I know how to describe it is that when a hitter flatterns their hands early, the hands naturally stay back because they are busy responding to the elbows swapping positions. As much as I try, I cannot disconnect my hands from my rear shoulder when I do what Ted does here at about the 30/31 second mark. YouTube - Ted Williams hitting

While Ted is busy flattening his hands early and setting up his hand pivot point, the hips have time to trigger. The hips lead the way and eventually pull the shoulders around. My daughter has always had great separation, but her hands would hang back and become disconnected as her shoulders rotated. In order to catch her hands up to the shoulders she would have to push the hands forward, which created the dreaded bat drag. The push and the bat drag are gone and the only thing we've changed is how she gets her hands flat.


Not if she starts her swing earlier.

That's basic math.

Again, the rearward movement of the bat is not the actual swing...at least the part of the swing forward towards the ball. Is Ted swinging the bat at the 30/31 second mark? Or, is he getting his hands flat quickly in order to launch his swing?



Not really.

See the Slaught link above.


I don't think there's any good proof of this. At best it's anecdotal.

I'm not sure what your disputing here.

 

[Wellphyt]

This may be a really basic question but what do you mean by getting the hands flat?

Does it mean palm up palm down on a plane parrell to the ground?

Yes it means palm up/palm down. The plane will vary based on pitch location.

If you include the dreaded "slot then swing", I believe that there are three ways to get the hands flat. Based on my experience with my daughter, only one of the three leads to a high level swing.

I demonstrate all three to the girls I work with, so they can better understand the differences.

 

[asurock]

Wellphyt,

I am interested in what you have been trying to explain. Do you happen to have video demonstrating the three ways of getting the hands flat? If you have any before/after clips of your daughter I would enjoy seeing how this concept improved her swing.

 

[crankermo]

Make that two of us. The more info and drills I get on this subject in particular the better.

 

[Mad4Ball]

Bump, looking for video of how this works

 

[rdbass]

Bump, looking for video of how this works

If you're looking for the 'cure' for 'bat drag' it's learn to use the hands correctly. Learn to get the barrel in a position to 'turn the barrel forward to the ball'.