Backswing vs. no backswing

[halskinner]

Bucket. It is not a big transition as you must think. The straight out of thr glove wind up is inherently already a part of the backswing wind up, just without the backswing. Tell her what I just said.

I will add, however, let her use both wind ups, against every batter. It is a good tactic to take away their timing. Every young pitcher is always a little afraid to use a 2nd windup, until they see how effective it is against the hitters. Then, there is no holding them back, they will love it.

Tell her what I said, she ALREADY DOES the 2nd wind up. She will catch on in a heartbeat!

 

[BoardMember]

There is actually a video clip of Fockard doing this in an ISF Championship game. Unfortunately, it screwed his timing up so bad he missed the zone by 10 feet when he did it.......Almost threw it to the backstop........Good thing there weren't any runners on at the time.......

Fast-Forward to 12:50 in this clip and you'll see this "world class" move........



Not a fan of this move at all.........For obvious reasons........

 

[halskinner]

There is actually a video clip of Fockard doing this in an ISF Championship game. Unfortunately, it screwed his timing up so bad he missed the zone by 10 feet when he did it.......Almost threw it to the backstop........Good thing there weren't any runners on at the time.......

Fast-Forward to 12:50 in this clip and you'll see this "world class" move........



Not a fan of this move at all.........For obvious reasons........

OMG! The announcer is mistaken on that one. The announcer said he "Didnt user a full wind up one." YES HE DID. Watch the speed of his wind up through the entire circle, fast - slow - fast! He is using one of my 'Delayed rotation' pitches. He didnt throw it for a strike but that is what it was.

Now I have to go back and watch all hisd pitches in this clip.

Thanks for the clip BM.

 

[curiousgeorge]

Batter from NZ is Travis Wilson. He plays on DD's team during the summers.

I saw Folkard live at a tournament where we could watch our PC's team play and see him pitch. In a word: WOW. Not many on this board can fathom how fast that is. Video doesn't do it justice. Movement is incredible but the velocity is beyond belief.

 

[sleepwalker]

When I taught my 11 year old dd how to serve a volleyball underhand during her 1st year of competitive volleyball, I taught her to use the backswing. I told her to reach up and back as far as she could with an open hand and then close her fist and grab her power and then force all that power threw the volleyball. We had to work on body positioning and footwork and where to strike the volleyball, but she learned at an accelerated pace because I used terminology that an 11 year old could use and process.

When I started teaching my dd to pitch a softball at 8 years old I taught her the same principles. Put all of her weight on her right foot, shift all of her weight to her left foot(lift right toes off of ground), reach back and grab all of her power(behind her body which is a backswing), and perform an arm circle and snap the ball through releasing when she brushed her inner hip bone with her forearm while holding the ball away from her body. We worked on footwork and stepping down the powerline etc. At 8 years old it was the simplist terminology and movement that I could give her without giving information overload. I tried to make it simpler by counting off a 4 step approach.

When I was teaching my dd how to pitch, I went to the softball parks and watched the competive softball girls and tried to copy the things that the successful girls pitchers were doing. I tried to teach her the basic fundamentals that would help her succeed in pitching until we started copying the pitching mechanics of other successful pitchers.

When I teach my dd to shoot a basketball, I go watch the successful girl basketball players around the state and try to copy their shooting styles. I do not go to the men's basketball games and try to copy the shooting style where men hold and shoot the ball above their head. I realize that she doesn't have the strength in her legs and arms and wrist to copy a man's basketball shooting style. So why not copy the good from the successful female athletes of the same physical stature?

I always try to keep it simple for my dd, because my dd will over analyze everything that I tell her . For instance, when running down the basketball court on an uncontested fastbreak, she will flare out to the wing position and stop. When I ask her what she is doing? She will reply, dad, this is where the coach told me to go every time down the court. Doh!!!

I took my 17 dd out the other day and had her pitch a softball without the back swing. She did it on her 4th or 5th try without any difficulty. Could she have done it at age 8? Probably, but I think it would have been a lot more work and more difficult for me to explain. Teaching her to reach back and grab power was easy to explain, both in softball and in volleyball.

 

[bucket pinata]

Just an update,Switched my 13 year old DD to the submarine/no back swing two days ago.timming did improve right away along with better control.She has long levers so the less movment the more control she has.She gets good drive off the rubber but did lose about 3-4 mph in speed.Hope that comes back in the not so distant future.But like board member said,once she made the switch she does not want to go back.

 

[halskinner]

Just an update,Switched my 13 year old DD to the submarine/no back swing two days ago.timming did improve right away along with better control.She has long levers so the less movment the more control she has.She gets good drive off the rubber but did lose about 3-4 mph in speed.Hope that comes back in the not so distant future.But like board member said,once she made the switch she does not want to go back.

BP,

are you saying she is now ONLY using the submarine wind up? This is now her bread and butter wind up?

 

[Ken B]

A submarine pitch with no back swing would likely result in more than a 3-4 MPH drop in speed.

 

[bucket pinata]

Yes,she rolls her hands out in front after rocking back and driving toward the plate.Hope that is called the submarine.I may have not discibed that quite correct.I have the feeling switching back and forth between the two might just be to much going on for her.When I mentioned she lost the speed she is first year 13 and had a top speed of 58 with an average game speed of 55-56 so dropping down to 53 with better movement is not the end of the world in my opinion.

 

[halskinner]

Sounds more like the backswing and the straight out of the glove wind ups. Normally, they will be 1 to 2 mph of each other from all my students experience. If you are doing the legal rockback as I have described on here, thats good. She will pick that speed back up with a little more experience.

Have her occassionally use both wind ups on the same batter, THEY HATE IT WHEN YOU DO THAT!