When is rec ball no longer rec ball?

[Country Boy]

When is rec ball no longer rec ball? To me it's pretty simple. If every girl who signs up is assigned/drafted to a team, it's rec. When you start culling players it ceases to be rec.

The competitiveness of a rec league will depend on what part of the country you're in and who's in charge of the league.

Short, concise and perfect response.

 

[Momo'sDad]

When is rec ball no longer rec ball? To me it's pretty simple. If every girl who signs up is assigned/drafted to a team, it's rec. When you start culling players it ceases to be rec.

The competitiveness of a rec league will depend on what part of the country you're in and who's in charge of the league.

A couple of years ago, the league drafted a 10u team with no coach. There were approximately 50 signups, but only 3 coaches. We have an annual dinner where the coaches meet their teams for the first time and that was when those players found out they had no coach. One of the dads stepped up and took the team. They had a really rough season, but had a good time and almost all the girls came back to play the following year. Thankfully, he returned to coach the following year, too, and had a really good season with a new group that he drafted himself. This past spring, *I* was the one who had to take a team at the last minute before players evals.

Based on the growth of the league, we anticipate needing possibly 7-8 coaches for our 10u division in the spring. We have 3 returning, and 3 probables coming up from 8u. But we have no idea who else might be interested. We all had 13-player rosters in the spring and both 10u fall teams are carrying 13 as well, but I do not want that many players again, unless 1 or 2 of them are splitting time between rec and a TB team. I want our league to select the coaches and then set a player registration limit based on the number of approved coaches we have.

 

[left turn]

Around here it is pretty easy to define. We have LL, which only plays LL and then we have TB.

The thing that has always frustrated me is the snobbishness that people show for girls that play LL but what something better than that. They are looked down upon for trying to better themselves. Our team is made up of 5 girls that have never played TB before and people give us grief for trying to learn the game. I mean what are these girls supposed to do if they want to get better. Move up to TB is the only way to do it. This fall we are 7-13, but we knew going in that we weren't going to be world beaters. Quit looking down your noses at girls that want to get better. End rant.

That has been my DD's experience as well. It's like a tough school where they make fun of the smart kids.

 

[PA SB Dad]

I want our league to select the coaches and then set a player registration limit based on the number of approved coaches we have.

I understand your frustration with the lack of coach volunteers in rec leagues but this is completely against what Little League stands for (my example of rec league). What I love about Little League is that it is all-inclusive - anyone can play, even those that can't afford the registration fees. It is an important community program that teaches hard-work, commitment, and sportsmanship. Limiting the number of kids that can play has no place in this program, IMHO.

In case people have forgotten the mission of Little League, here it is:

Little League Baseball, Incorporated is a non-profit organization whose mission is to "to promote, develop, supervise, and voluntarily assist in all lawful ways, the interest of those who will participate in Little League Baseball and Softball."

Through proper guidance and exemplary leadership, the Little League program assists youth in developing the qualities of citizenship, discipline, teamwork and physical well-being. By espousing the virtues of character, courage and loyalty, the Little League Baseball and Softball program is designed to develop superior citizens rather than superior athletes.

I run the SB program for our local Little League. I know how hard it is to get parents to step up and coach. I've also been an assistant coach for my DD's TB team the past few years (a very good A team that won ASA States and PONY Nationals last year). The goals of the two programs are different. TB is very exclusive by it's very nature of cutting players who aren't good enough (however you want to define that). Rec leagues, and by that I mean Little League, allows everyone in that wants to play, and it is up to the parents to step up and make it a good experience for the kids. It is up to the adults to find ways to make it work. I know it is hard and very frustrating, but in the end is well worth the effort.

 

[marriard]

Due to the very large number of TB teams here in this area, it's simply not as big of a deal to hear "My DD plays for a TB team". Saying that may carry much more weight in a different locale. I am not saying that to demean the accomplishments of the girls here locally that play TB, or anywhere for that matter, just trying to give others an indication of how the two compare here in this particular area.

You hit on a good point there. There are at 7 or 8 decent travel organizations (many with 2 teams in an age division) within 30 minutes drive of my house and just as many rec-ball leagues. The TB team I coach doesn't have to leave the county unless we really want to as there is at least 24 travel teams in the age division within the county and probably close to 75 teams within driving distance in the counties north and south of us. Lots and lots of competition and opportunities to play travel level softball.

 

[Momo'sDad]

I understand your frustration with the lack of coach volunteers in rec leagues but this is completely against what Little League stands for (my example of rec league). What I love about Little League is that it is all-inclusive - anyone can play, even those that can't afford the registration fees. It is an important community program that teaches hard-work, commitment, and sportsmanship. Limiting the number of kids that can play has no place in this program, IMHO.

In case people have forgotten the mission of Little League, here it is:

Little League Baseball, Incorporated is a non-profit organization whose mission is to "to promote, develop, supervise, and voluntarily assist in all lawful ways, the interest of those who will participate in Little League Baseball and Softball."

Through proper guidance and exemplary leadership, the Little League program assists youth in developing the qualities of citizenship, discipline, teamwork and physical well-being. By espousing the virtues of character, courage and loyalty, the Little League Baseball and Softball program is designed to develop superior citizens rather than superior athletes.

I run the SB program for our local Little League. I know how hard it is to get parents to step up and coach. I've also been an assistant coach for my DD's TB team the past few years (a very good A team that won ASA States and PONY Nationals last year). The goals of the two programs are different. TB is very exclusive by it's very nature of cutting players who aren't good enough (however you want to define that). Rec leagues, and by that I mean Little League, allows everyone in that wants to play, and it is up to the parents to step up and make it a good experience for the kids. It is up to the adults to find ways to make it work. I know it is hard and very frustrating, but in the end is well worth the effort.

I don't disagree with any of what you're saying, but resources - which includes coaches - do dictate just how many players a league/division can have. I sort of got bullied into taking my first time, but I'm glad things worked out the way they did. We had an awesome year! All but 1 player are staying in softball.

Some will argue that there's no effective difference between a roster of 12 and a roster of 13 or 14, but when the ideal number is 10 or 11, it is a big difference. I've always said I would take 12 or 13 if it kept kids from being left out and I've stuck to that, but it's not an ideal situation. I know the kids just want to play and I believe they should get that opportunity, but I don't think I could manage 2 teams in the same age division, no matter how fair I was about it. I've told the league I don't want more than 11 next spring, but the by-laws permit them to make us take up to 12 and of course I don't want to protest when player #13 shows up.

We're a suburban league where most parents are supportive, but who do love the fact that others are doing the coaching.

 

[Sweet Lou]

I don't disagree with any of what you're saying, but resources - which includes coaches - do dictate just how many players a league/division can have. I sort of got bullied into taking my first time, but I'm glad things worked out the way they did. We had an awesome year! All but 1 player are staying in softball.

Some will argue that there's no effective difference between a roster of 12 and a roster of 13 or 14, but when the ideal number is 10 or 11, it is a big difference. I've always said I would take 12 or 13 if it kept kids from being left out and I've stuck to that, but it's not an ideal situation. I know the kids just want to play and I believe they should get that opportunity, but I don't think I could manage 2 teams in the same age division, no matter how fair I was about it. I've told the league I don't want more than 11 next spring, but the by-laws permit them to make us take up to 12 and of course I don't want to protest when player #13 shows up.

We're a suburban league where most parents are supportive, but who do love the fact that others are doing the coaching.

I agree 11 might be ideal in rec but 12 is very workable with the 6 inning rec league games in our area. Every girl sits one inning when you have 12 girls in our rec league; very fair from a participation standpoint. Sometimes not so much from putting the most competitive team on the field.

13 becomes a bit of pain I agree. I've had that a few times. But if you don't have enough to feild an extra team or 10, 11 or 12 then sometimes one or two teams gets saddled with that 13th player.

Again it is rec where every kid is supposed to get a chance, not a select all-star team or travel ball team.

 

[FPMark]

The difference between rec and travel is when you have to pay. If you pay before tryouts, it's rec.

 

[Country Boy]

I agree 11 might be ideal in rec but 12 is very workable with the 6 inning rec league games in our area. Every girl sits one inning when you have 12 girls in our rec league; very fair from a participation standpoint. Sometimes not so much from putting the most competitive team on the field.

13 becomes a bit of pain I agree. I've had that a few times. But if you don't have enough to feild an extra team or 10, 11 or 12 then sometimes one or two teams gets saddled with that 13th player.

Again it is rec where every kid is supposed to get a chance, not a select all-star team or travel ball team.

The last year that I coached Rec I had 17 girls. One of the worst coaching experiences of my life. I felt like I wasn't able to teach anybody anything.

 

[CoachScott]

13 becomes a bit of pain I agree. I've had that a few times. But if you don't have enough to feild an extra team or 10, 11 or 12 then sometimes one or two teams gets saddled with that 13th player.

13 is still small for rec. and is quite manageable. My last year rec. team had 15, the 10U coach had 17. No one gets cut. those are hard to manage and league rules state that every player must play at least 2 innings in the field with a continuous batting order. Next year is shaping up to be even bigger but that is good because we then can split out to 2 teams.