Umpire's Call

[02Crush]

We are on defense. Runner on 3rd. 1 out. Batter at plate has a 0-1 count. 2nd pitch batter offers to bunt. As the ball enters zone she does not bunt the ball but does drop the bat at home plate and runs to 1st (and eventually to 2nd). Our catcher did not glove the ball cleanly in an attempt to avoid the bat being dropped by her. She picks up the ball in front of her, rises up and steps out in front of the plate looking at the batter oddly for departing on no hit as if it were D3. She later told me she was baffled because the coaches were yelling "run" to the batter as if it were a D3. She wanted to throw the ball to 1st but knew the count was only 0-1 so she did not. In all the confusion the runner on 3rd came in behind her and steps on home plate.

Umpire's ruling. Batter was brought back to complete her at bat. 1 strike on her for offering so now she has a 1-1 count. Runner on third scores. I asked why the runner was not placed back on 3rd as the batter had not hit the ball, been HBP, been walked or encountered a D3. Furthermore the ball was not a passed ball. It just seemed like a trick to confuse the catcher by drawing her attention towards the batter so the 3rd base runner could sneak in home. Would this not be dead ball and all is placed back as is for batter to complete her at bat? I really do not know what is right here which is why I am asking. We have never experienced this which I ask. We did end up with the win 5-4 but this play was just weird all around and I was wondering if as a coach I am missing out on the rules somehow or should be considering this as a tactic. Seems kind of bush league if you ask me but we will now have to prepare to defend this kind of stuff.

 

[cmustangsfp]

Bush league. It is the old fake dropped third strike trick. You have to teach your catcher to be disciplined to not fall for it. Teach your catcher that the "Look back rule" is not in effect until the pitcher has the ball in the circle. It is not a dead ball situation. The runner from 3rd stole home. Your catcher needs to be instructed to tag anyone coming home.

I would have argued that it was making a travesty of the game because the coach knew (or should have known) the count and should not been instructing his player to run, unless he was trying to make a travesty of the game. Not that it would have went anywhere... but my point would have been made to the blue.

I personally go over this situation with my catchers and until they have it down solid, I create a DTS sign so they know when it is in effect. I also instruct them on a DTS to watch the runner on 3rd and many times to fake the throw and then get the runner charging hard from 3rd.

You will see this bush league tactic from coaches that are not very good.

 

[Comp]

If the batter already had an 0-1 count and the umpire indicated she offered on the bunt attempt, that would make the count 0-2 not 1-1.

The catcher and defense should be aware of the count and situation and know that no throw was warranted on the batter. Nothing illegal about it, runner from 3rd stole home.

 

[Umpire]

A dozen people could give you a dozen viable ways of handling the play. I may not necessarily handle it the same way in a 12u game as I would a DI one game.

When I had a similar play, the plate umpire yelled out "It's 3 & 2, that's only ball 3" twice. The batter turned, looked at him, and disregarded his statement. The coaches also heard him but instructed her to continue running. I called "time," directed the batter back to home plate and put the runner back (in this case she was R2 from 2nd base). In my case, I killed the play before either could advance to a base, which helped eliminate the "Well, she gets to stay at 3rd argument" since she couldn't "stay" somewhere she hadn't obtained.

You should have seen the look on the coach's face when I said, "If you are teaching your batter to run on ball 3, then you are teaching them to deliberately violate a rule. That's unsportsmanlike and you can expect ejections if anything similar happens. It's not gamesmanship, it's cheating." The coach denied that it was a trick play so I called him out asking, "So your runners from 2nd base routinely steal 3rd base on a walk when the catcher has the ball in her hand; or is it only after you, the 1st base coach and the batter all lose track of the count after it's repeated 3 or 4 times." The coach asked another umpire the following day what he would do in my situation since he runs that trick play. The umpire responded that same as I did and added that if he knew it was intentional, he would eject the coach. The next time that coach wants a second opinion, he shouldn't ask someone who serves on the executive board with me.

There is no "travesty of the game" other than referring to a runner who purposely runs the bases in reverse order to create confusion. There is still unsportsmanlike conduct. Though some will disagree, I think that it is unsportsmanlike for an adult to teach a player to violate a rule, disregard the instructions of an umpire and attempt to gain an advantage by going outside the limits of the rule book.

By rule, the batter has not become the batter-runner and is not legally permitted to run in the first place. I think that is what people need to keep in mind. It's not a case of a BR overrunning 1st base, starting back toward 1st base slowly, then seeing that the defenders have gone back to their position, taking off for 2nd base (which is permitted in NCAA); or similarly, when the defense does this on purpose, abandoning the base, to get the BR to run and then having the CF come in and cover. Those are all legal moves to begin with.

Starting with the first wrongdoing, ask yourself what would have happened if people played the way they should have. You'll likely find a reasonable answer, which would lead you to a justifiable ruling.

 

[Comp]

Would you still call time if the defense was heads up enough to know the situation and go after the lead runner? If so, how do you explain to the defensive coach why you are putting the runner his team just threw out back on base? If you wouldnt call time, then you are changing how you call the play based on the way the defense is handling the situation.

 

[BrianMonk]

We are on defense. Runner on 3rd. 1 out. Batter at plate has a 0-1 count. 2nd pitch batter offers to bunt. As the ball enters zone she does not bunt the ball but does drop the bat at home plate and runs to 1st (and eventually to 2nd).

Consider it a valuable lesson for your team and catcher. Botching that play is a great way to motivate your "memory" and also get a better undstanding of the game. She'll remember, she doesn't need (or should get) help from the umpire.

Another issue that's far more common but even gets more experienced catchers (occasionally) is a D3K (or just strike 3), runner on 1st, less than 2 outs. The batter usually runs towards 1st and sometimes the runner on 1st goes to 2nd. If your catcher throws to 1st, your opponent just stole 2nd base. Teach them to throw to 2nd in that situation.

 

[Umpire]

Would you still call time if the defense was heads up enough to know the situation and go after the lead runner? If so, how do you explain to the defensive coach why you are putting the runner his team just threw out back on base? If you wouldnt call time, then you are changing how you call the play based on the way the defense is handling the situation.

I called time before the defense could execute a play and before the offense could advance. That's why I called time. I thought that was clear. Neither team was favored or disfavored. I'm not about to engage in 300 what if scenarios. I gave my opinion and even said that other people may call it differently. I called it the way I thought was right for the situation.

 

[ORBlue]

I think the age group of the teams makes a factor how the umpire manages a game.

If this situation happened in a 12U or under.....based on the level of play (A; B; C divisions)...I could be calling time to prevent a disaster from happening.

If it happened in an A level and players were 14U and up.....I could be doing something else.

I don't see just one response as the ONLY response for the umpire. Some probably won't agree with this response....but sometimes that is what it is.

 

[02Crush]

If the batter already had an 0-1 count and the umpire indicated she offered on the bunt attempt, that would make the count 0-2 not 1-1.

The catcher and defense should be aware of the count and situation and know that no throw was warranted on the batter. Nothing illegal about it, runner from 3rd stole home.

Correct. Late night typo on my part.

 

[Umpire]

Umpire: "Coach, can your batter count to three? Can your first base coach count to three? Can you count to three?"
Coach: "Yeah, what difference does it make?"
Umpire: "Well, since only two pitches have been thrown, how is it logical that not only your batter and your first base coach couldn't keep track of the count, but neither could you. Wouldn't three pitches have to be thrown to get to an uncaught third strike?"
Coach: "Maybe we just forgot the count."
Umpire: "Did you forget the count when you had your batter bunt with "two strikes" or when you told her to run with "two strikes?"
Coach: "Uhh" followed by a cock and bull story.

An umpire who is confident in his ability would immediately call the batter back to the plate. It has nothing to do with what the catcher should do in this situation. It has to do with not allowing the batter to do something that she shouldn't be doing in the first place. By rule, the batter has no right to run until she becomes the batter-runner by rule. That didn't happen here. Though I can't see myself enforcing it the first time it happened, if it was repeated, I can easily see an interference call (yes, it does meet the criteria) followed by an immediate ejection. Sorry folks, but telling a player to knowingly and deliberately violate a rule is unsporting conduct both on behalf of the coach and the player.