Too Many Teams

[Rick M]

One big thing is that the loss of rec has removed a 'safe' place for pitchers to develop. Now anyone who can throw strikes are recruited into 10U travel where people are paying $$$$ and the pressure is on. That is rough and I am seeing pitchers dropping pitching because it is a lot of pressure on a kid who may have learned to pitch as little as 6 months ago.

This is a big issue as well. There are so many girls who play softball for nine weeks in a Rec program and just want to keep playing. What are their options? Many local programs have a town travel team where kids can take the next step and continue their development, but many more do not.

Back when DD first started playing, everyone on her Rec team wanted to continue into the fall. The local league wanted nothing to do with having a town travel team. Why? Because some parents of boys on the baseball side did it and pulled all of their players out of the Rec program. So we had no choice but to create our own team and go it alone. Big surprise - the team folded after one season.

So, when I see these postings online about new teams looking for one or two more players, I see my own daughter in the same situation just a few years ago. They're not trying to ruin softball, they're just trying to keep their girls playing.

 

[_MIA_]

Now that the silly season of tryouts is wrapping up, it's time for the local coaches out there to switch gears from posting their tryout info online to posting rants about how there are too many teams and that the talent pool is too diluted. There are raging discussions on three local TB message boards that I follow at the moment.

I'm struggling to understand the problem here. I think it's great that there are so many teams, and so many opportunities for girls to play softball at whatever level they are able to compete. The biggest gripe I hear from coaches is this 'dilution' of talent, but I can't get my head around why this is an issue.

I live in PA but DD plays for a team in NJ. Last season there were 10 A-level teams in NJ at the 12U level. In reality, the top four or five were way ahead of the rest. To me, that represents a problem of concentration, not dilution. If four teams have such a surplus of talent at 1-9, and four pitchers who dominate, what good does that do anyone? These are the coaches that are complaining that they have to travel out of state just to play a competitive game.

The funniest thing is the coaches that are starting new teams, and then complaining that there are too many teams out there and that they can't fill a roster. Well, boo-hoo Nobody is flocking to your Triple Diamond Elite Premiere Select Ladybugs even though you're a 12-time runner up for NFCA coach of the year. Oh, and your daughter is a pitcher.

Sorry, that's my rant for the day. If someone has a cogent argument for why there should be fewer softball teams in the world, I'm all ears.

This is a problem where there are two stable states (where here the state is the number teams) and then the state which TB is in now, which is unstable but seems to be trending towards one of the stable solutions. The two stable solutions are
a) The way it used to be before TB. In other words for the most part each town/region/etc had a league and fixed number of teams. You tried out and if you made it you played. If you didn't you tried again next year. In the TB case this number would be imposed by some local Federation e.g. you can only have X teams in A, Y teams in B, etc. This won't ever happen.

b) The other stable solution is the one which corresponds to the total number pitchers in an age group. If you have X pitchers in an age group you can at most have X teams. This is the stable solution which TB is trending towards it seems. Obviously 1 pitcher per team isn't enough so the actual state (e.g. number of teams) is less than X but you get the point.

I personally don't have an issue with what is going on. The biggest problem imo is that many parents don't have a realistic view of their child's ability and/or are not willing to work with their child to improve their kid's standing on the team they are on. If these parents are inclined to coach, they will just start a new team so that their kid can be the (SS,bat 4th, be the #1 pitcher, etc,etc). I think this may improve as the TB kids of today move on and have kids of their own as they will have the wisdom of experience in the TB setting and will perhaps realize that the grass isn't always greener.

 

[uncdrew]

Before posting this, I took a quick glance at the 16U portion of the local bulletin board. Since this past Sunday (8/11), no less than 8 teams have posted looking for an "A-level" or "Elite" pitcher or pitchers (plural). And only a couple of those are teams that I recognize and know to be legit A-level teams. I think the problem is that there just aren't enough A-level pitchers to go around. One excellent and two or three "meh" pitchers do not an elite A-level team make. It's like in Mean Girls: Coach, stop trying to make "A-level" happen!

Are you referring to GA Coaches Corner?

My DD was recruited pretty hard, to be #1 pitcher of several 10U teams. Seems most of the teams we talk to are even struggling to have two good pitchers, let alone one. And yeah, that isn't enough to be A-level in my mind either.

 

[CMMom1740]

Are you referring to GA Coaches Corner?

My DD was recruited pretty hard, to be #1 pitcher of several 10U teams. Seems most of the teams we talk to are even struggling to have two good pitchers, let alone one. And yeah, that isn't enough to be A-level in my mind either.

Yes, that’s the one!

 

[The Man In Blue]

I don’t necessarily think the quantity of teams is the issue — it appears that way, but it is a symptom, not the problem. Really, it is the overall product quality due to a lack of any system to provide checks and balances.

One part of the solution: when there is an abundance of teams, as there is now, organizations — be it sanctioning bodies or local leagues — should have a mechanism for assigning teams to the appropriate level of play. Similar to relegation/promotion in professional soccer. That requires some involvement beyond just taking the teams’ checks though.

Next part of the solution: if you want to run a high-quality program or tournament, you have to limit the number of teams involved. I’m not saying lower numbers equates to better play ... I’m saying control equals a better customer experience. You can’t be going in to a Friday tournament and be adding/dropping teams and changing the schedule on Tuesday.

Over time, that will eventually lead to “natural-selection” kicking in and you will see the overall number/quality of teams start to change for the better.

 

[uncdrew]

Yes, that’s the one!

It's a great resource for sure.

And interesting to watch the focus predictably turn from TRYOUTS!!!! to "Need one XYZ player to complete roster" about this time of year.

 

[justanotherguy]

I admit, I've always enjoyed watching the tryout posts from year to year. My DD came from baseball to softball a year and a half ago. Yet, I've always watched the SB boards because I knew, someday, she'd be headed to SB. There are some teams, good or bad, that I won't even consider for my DD. This is solely from how many posts I've seen each year. There are still a lot of teams, tons actually, that I don't know anything about. In the end, I laugh at posts from folks like this. It comes down to one of those inspirational posters I saw in my CIO's office many years back. It read, something along the lines of: "Change is inevitable, those that fail to change will simply fade away."

Yup, rec and travel ball is very different from what it was 20, 10, 5 years ago. Guess what? Change happens. Adapt, or fade away.

 

[badmonkey]

It's a great resource for sure.

And interesting to watch the focus predictably turn from TRYOUTS!!!! to "Need one XYZ player to complete roster" about this time of year.

"We are still looking for one dominate pitcher, and one super athletic utility player that can hit the ball 300'. (all positions open) Come give us a look!"

 

[uncdrew]

"We are still looking for one dominate pitcher, and one super athletic utility player that can hit the ball 300'. (all positions open) Come give us a look!"

Fortunately my DD fills both those roles for them. :-D

 

[Rick M]

One part of the solution: when there is an abundance of teams, as there is now, organizations — be it sanctioning bodies or local leagues — should have a mechanism for assigning teams to the appropriate level of play.

This is kind of the Holy Grail, isn't it? If there were just one governing body that could make a determination about what level teams play on and try to set up a system of fair divisions where there would be parity. That won't happen, of course, because there will always be teams that are unhappy with their placement and competing leagues spring up like weeds around here.

One other point that gets mentioned often on DFP that relates -- girls mature at such a different rate that today's A-level team at 10U could very well be tomorrow's C-level team at 14U. Ideally, the reverse happens.