Rec ball priorities

[KCM]

My 5 years of coaching rec ball was to lay the foundation of proper skills in the game of softball. If I could teach them the correct mechanics and had eager students, we would win majority of the time.

All positive and having fun.

 

[sluggers]

The organization had 3 trips to the world series in 10 years, the last trip was my group in 2005. ( 10U ) Since then they have switched to a more "Rec" like you are speaking about. The last 5 years in a row they have not even made it out of Regions. They have dropped down to 250 kids registered. Myself and other coaches who coached in the "glory" days still feel the lack of competitiveness that they switched to killed the organization. What was once the pride of the community, is now a joke.

What I find ironic is that under the prior system which you liked so much you took your whole team and left--resulting in the loss of probably some of their best players. In the same breath, you attribute the decline in number of players to the organization becoming more "rec".

The deal is that travel ball has become ridiculously popular. If parents want a competitive environment for the kids, they play travel ball. So, *of course* the rec leagues become weaker.

I always start the year with a few wise words to my girls. "Winning is not everything..............it's the only thing".

That is ridiculous. Trying to take something Vince Lombardi said to a bunch of professional ball players and apply it to rec league softball is beyond silly.

How far do you go? Should the Saints' approach be followed in rec ball--i.e., "I want you to try to take out the ACL of the 2nd baseman"?

And, since only one team "wins", does that make all the other teams failures? And, how about yourself? How many national championships have your teams won? If they don't win the championship, are they failures?

 

[GOINGDEEP]

What I find ironic is that under the prior system which you liked so much you took your whole team and left--resulting in the loss of probably some of their best players. In the same breath, you attribute the decline in number of players to the organization becoming more "rec".

Pretty harsh words, but I'm game.

What happened the last year really turned the better coaches and players away. A new "president" of the league wanted to split up the better players. In the years before you ( as a coach ) could keep a core of 8 players from your year before. The rest went into a draft and each coach had 1 pick a turn until the rosters were full. ( usually 12 players )

This idiot changed it to only keeping your child and the 2 other children of the assistant coaches. So I've invested 3 prior years developing my core ( in which I spent many-many more hours than the other coaches ) only to turn them over to yet another idiot. Not only was I furious, but so were the players who got split up and the parents who had to deal with another team.

So........lets just punish a team for working extra hard for 3 years and split them among teams who have no leadership or drive? This was not only in my age group, but across the board. I was only in 10U, can you imagine how mad the older groups were that had invested 6-8 years developing a core?

The absolute bottom line was the "presidents" DD had tried out for a local TB team the year before. She didn't make it and he, from that point on, despised TB and anyone who played or coached.

That is ridiculous. Trying to take something Vince Lombardi said to a bunch of professional ball players and apply it to rec league softball is beyond silly.

Quotes stay with people, especially famous ones. What should I have said? " Don't worry about the next 75mins, maybe mommy will get you an ice cream after "?

I'm going to pump them up, give them a dab of desire.

And, since only one team "wins", does that make all the other teams failures? And, how about yourself? How many national championships have your teams won? If they don't win the championship, are they failures?

In a match up between 2 teams the only two outcomes are a winner.......and a loser. Does that make them a "failure", no. But yes, they are considered the loser.

Championships? Yea, we've won quite a few since 8U and lost a few. Multi state championships, World Series championships, NIT championships. Over the years we have played in 10 states.

But I'll answer the National's question too. No sir, we haven't even played in Nationals. The biggest factor would be finances. I have some great talent from a 2.5 hour driving span. Some families lost jobs during the recession, some went to single income. Some who owned their own business had to cut back. So yes, our dreams of going to Nationals got smothered under the economy.

But within the 3 states we played most of the time on weekends ( a tri-state area ) we very rarely lost a tournament. I've posted this before, last year we outscored opponents 256 to 96.

Let's be 100% honest here. You can buy your way to a National Championship. My nephew's TB team is based in TN, National Tournaments they flew in a pitcher from Florida and West Virginia. We played in a FP Gold Tournament in 2010, one Gold team based in MS flew in a pitcher from Georgia. Money can fix anything.

 

[GOINGDEEP]

Tell you what, our next game is Tuesday, and it's gonna be a tough one. I'll go around to each kid and ask what's more important to them "winning", "playing well", "being with friends", "improving", or "giving their best".

I promise I will post the results, even if they are not in my favor. But I'll go on record now that 90% will say winning.

Now you could have won this debate and poll if you had included "time with my boyfriend".

 

[JAD]

I would add 'teach good sportsmanship' to the list......

 

[2 DD Coach]

When it's 100 degrees out and the girls are on the field doing grounder drills, how much "fun" do you think they are having? Or the catcher in the same heat in their fifth inning of a double header. Is having fun whats driving them? Or is it the desire to be competitive and ultimately(GASP)win.

I tell my teams we are not there to have fun, we are there to have fun playing softball. There is a big difference between the two. And part of playing softball games is to try and win those games. Is it the only measure of how your teams performing? No. You pick out the good parts and be happy with your progress. Then you look at the bad, and work to improve them, and yes, it does require work.
Halfway through the season, when everyone on your team has seen improvment, and you are winning games, why keep practicing? What is it that your working for?

Simplify your question, since we are talking about 8-10 yr olds. Ask them before the next game if they want to win or lose. What do you bet the answer is. Everyone wants to win, and that desire shouldnt make you a pariah, coach or player. What you do to win, or how you deal with losing, thats what makes the difference.

I keep seeing a lot of posts with people stating, we did x and y and then we just ended up winning games. So yes, winning was important enough for you to state you were able to do it your way, which obviously you deem the right way, AND WIN GAMES. I have yet to read one post on here stating "we did x and y and got our butt kicked every game and it sure was fun!"

So like GOINGDEEP, I'll come out and say it. My goal every season is to coach my team, by giving them direction, and the desire to put in the work it takes to improve, with the goal of winning games. I am able to do that without resorting to some bush league tactics, or trampling on the feelings of my players. They learn how to lose and be good sports about it, but care enough to show up the next practice and work to improve so you have a better shot at winning the next one.

Ice cream shouldn't be a reward for winning a game. Ice cream should be a reward for working hard enough to be able to win a game.

 

[PA SB Dad]

Good Grief!! I go away on vacation for a week and look what happens! Have you all lost your minds and perspective?

Everyone has their own idea of what "rec" is, and just how important winning is. I run the softball program for our rec league (Little League), so from where I sit, we don't keep score at 8U, winning at 10U is not very important, and at 12U and 14U, teaching the kids to learn how to win becomes increasingly important, but not the end of the world if they lose. By HS, they should be prepared to know how to win with class and lose with grace. We don't give out participation trophies, but we do acknowledge the winners with medals for their accomplishments, and we want the girls to be proud of those.

But, talk to a 10U rec coach who is in the middle of all of it, and winning is validation of how good they are, whereas losing just makes them feel like the parents see them as inadequate. I've even had conversations with 8U coach pitch coaches who feel they need to justify their "coaching credentials" by doing well, and we don't keep score in those games!!

At 12U and 14U rec, my batting order has been anything like: one week it is alphabetical by middle name, the next week, shortest to tallest, and the next week, alphabetical by the name of the state where they were born. What I try to teach them is I don't care where they are batting, just learn to contribute when their turn comes. I've coached the same set of rec kids from 8U all through 14U, and finally lost some to HS ball. What I hope they took away is that everyone on the team can contribute something that the team needs to be successful, but I don't measure my success by wins and losses. I measure success by how many come back each year, and how many encourage their friends to play.

The game has to be fun for the kids to participate each year. My main goal is to teach them that mastering the skills necessary to be a good teammate helps make the game fun, and the wins will take care of themselves.

 

[CoogansBluff]

This idiot changed it to only keeping your child and the 2 other children of the assistant coaches. So I've invested 3 prior years developing my core ( in which I spent many-many more hours than the other coaches ) only to turn them over to yet another idiot. Not only was I furious, but so were the players who got split up and the parents who had to deal with another team.

Why is your core so important to you? Were you planning to move that group to a travel ball team?

Also, you retain your core, will you have the most skilled (best) team?

 

[GOINGDEEP]

Why is your core so important to you? Were you planning to move that group to a travel ball team?

Also, you retain your core, will you have the most skilled (best) team?

Core was important in this league because it helped you weed out the problem parents, helped you keep the kids who you have invested the time to coach, you were shooting for winning the Organization's Earned World Series. That's why the league now can't make it out of the first round of playoffs. They move the kids around on different teams so much, the allstars never truly function as one team during a season for practice.

We were already traveling 8U and 10U. But with the same group of girls as the league. And, that's where we were getting the experience and pulling away from the pack. But that was our choice, that was on our time. While the other teams are watching cartoons Saturday morning we were playing TB.

Let me add that these girls on my Rec and TB ( 8-10U ) team all came from the same township. Population of 3500 at the time. You had to be a resident to play in this league. Same girls ( mostly ) who are now playing HS ball together. So I wasn't building a Tb team from other cities, other counties, or other states. I was using what was right in front of me, coaching them the best we could with what we had.


After the demise of the REC, yes we started branching out and picking up players outside of our own backyard. Some of the original players moved, some quit, some couldn't keep up, etc.

Edit***
These girls signed up and played rec before we started any TB with them. This league started from 4 years old and up.

 

[CoogansBluff]

Core was important in this league because it helped you weed out the problem parents, helped you keep the kids who you have invested the time to coach, you were shooting for winning the Organization's Earned World Series. That's why the league now can't make it out of the first round of playoffs. They move the kids around on different teams so much, the allstars never truly function as one team during a season for practice.

I assume that this team you'd like to keep together would have most of the all-stars and dominated the rec league? Just making sure I understand it. I'm hesitant to comment on other leagues because you have to see it first-hand to know what you're talking about. But I can understand that natural dilemma this causes. Uneven teams can cause problems, and so can splitting up kids and parents that strongly prefer one coach and core of players.