Is this pitch legal? - Part II

[tigergrowls]

Tried to indicate in the original thread title that I added some more video, but could not get it to read out, so adding the new videos here so they will be seen. We tried to get the toe down with laces forward to eliminate the crowhop in day 2 as a priority. It looks like her arm spin is behind where it needs to be in relation to her stride leg timing, so should I get her to start the armspin and get to say the 9 position before striding forward?

Thanks!!

Day 1 - Side View
YouTube - 100_2875.mov

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Made adjustments based on feedback and filmed it.

Day 2 - Back View
YouTube - 100_2879.mov

Day 2 - Side View
YouTube - 100_2877.mov

Tigergrowls

 

[FPump]

I guess I'm confused. The videos in II are the same as in the original post.
I'm seeing the same thing, a replant, Not on every pitch (by that I mean, not that I can see clearly enough to be able to call and explain the IP)...but there are segements where I can see it, and see it clearly.
Bottom line, whether the videos in II are different than those in the IP or not....there's still a replant on certain pitches..IP.
I will grant you though, that without the advantage of replaying it on video, and slowing ot down, she could just as easily NOT get called for an IP. Now that does not mean that she is legal, it just means that the umps could not see it clearly enough to justify an IP call.
Remember, despite opposing coaches yelling at us to call IP's, we can't "guess" an IP. We have to see it, and be sure of what we saw, to be able to identify WHAT PART OF THE PITCH WAS NOT LEGAL before we call an IP.

 

[tigergrowls]

I could not modify the thread title on the original thread alerting that new video had been added, so I created the new thread. I removed the new videos from the original thread. Do you see any improvement between day1 and day2 at all?

 

[halskinner]

She looks better in the latest ones, I dont see a replant at all.

What I do see is this; she is focusing on the feet and the arm circle is just kind of coming along for the ride. Very slow and weak wind up. I have news for her. A windmill pitcher can throw within 5 mph underhand than she can overhand. Now the big question; is she throwing as fast underhand as she can overhand? Not even close from this video.

Ask her if she is pitching fast pitch or slow pitch? She is way too relaxed to be throwing hard. Say whatever you need to say to piss her off , make her mad and find some more speed.

If she can throw faster when she is mad,,,, she can throw faster when she is NOT mad. Is everything she does as slww and easy as these pitches we are seeing? As strong as she looks, she should be throwing twice as fast as she is. Tell her the ball is a hand grenade and she has 1 second before it goes off.

With every pitch she throws, yell "Throw hard". "Throw hard". "THROW HARD". about the 10th time she hears that with a little irritation in your voice, she will get mad and start throwing harder,

Many times I would ask the parents to bring their catcher with them, full gear. I would work with the catchers and tell THEM what to say during the game to REALLY tick the pitchers off. A little public humiliation, a little kick in the ego can work miracles. They will throw faster just to shut that dang catcher up. Continually yelling "Throw Hard" until she is actually throwing her hardest is the best and simplest one to do.

Hal

 

[Jojo]

When my kids aren't throwing as hard as I think they should, I say "It's not called toss pitch!"

 

[tigergrowls]

LOL....I can get her mad!! She normally throws harder than that. She was focusing on the proper footwork as a priority for the video. I told her she has to bring it during the games while maintaining good footwork. We also are working on the arm hitch. She recently went from an arm back windup to holding the ball in the glove and pumping and it has gotten her holding the ball facing third instead of first on the spin. We are working hard to get the arm spin right and the footwork right and I think a lot of the other stuff will just fall into place at that point.

Thanks for all feedback!!

 

[BoardMember]

LOL....I can get her mad!! She normally throws harder than that. She was focusing on the proper footwork as a priority for the video. I told her she has to bring it during the games while maintaining good footwork. We also are working on the arm hitch. She recently went from an arm back windup to holding the ball in the glove and pumping and it has gotten her holding the ball facing third instead of first on the spin. We are working hard to get the arm spin right and the footwork right and I think a lot of the other stuff will just fall into place at that point.

Thanks for all feedback!!

There is a small replant......Sometimes......But that should be the LEAST of your worries Tiger..........

You DD has MAJOR upper body and arm circle problems........That will likely kill her chances of succeeding.........And could possibly unduce injury to her muscles/tendons/ligiments of the shoulder socket down the road.......To be brutally honest IMO, any pitching coach that either coaches.....or allows this upper body action should be banned from coaching pitchers.........

Do you have any idea why her arm "hitches"?..........If not, then you can't work on it.........

I think your DD's lower body is better then average.........I think her arm positions/upper body are horrible.........The more you tell her to "quicken" her arm spin using these mechanics the worst it gets........And the more potential for injury..........And of course, no offense to Hal, but advise like "get her mad so she can throw it harder" is very dangerous advise considering her potential for unjury with her flaws..........

See if you understand this:

Here is another pitch showing the hitch over the top. Notice the position of the ball just before it passes over the top causing pressure in the socket over the top. Her upper arm moves horizontally/laterally across her shoulder line vs. vertically over the shoulder line because the pressure won't allow it to extend vertically.

This is the hitch that exists:

Notice this young lady has the ball facing down, NOT UP, when her arm is still infront of her face, allowing for proper "pressureless" flow over the top and down the backside.........

Sorry to be so blunt but I hate to see good talent wasted like this........And the potential damage it can cause when improper mechanics are being taught or used, and improper advise is given unwittingly...........And it kills me to know that coaches out there allow this stuff........

Best Regards......

 

[JC heir]

Nice call BM.......might save that gal arm injury.

 

[tigergrowls]

BoardMember,

Very excellent analysis!! I and others also saw this arm problem while studying the crow hop problem. This is the first time I have ever filmed her. Part of the problem is that I catch her 99% of the time which makes it impossible to see everything. A pitching coach standing right beside her still cannot see fine details that become visible on film. I will be filming her regularly from now on. We are working hard to address this problem. She apparently picked it up when she went to a pump windup with both hands together in front where the ball is being held in the glove and naturally sits sideways toward 3rd...she just started unconciously going into her spin with it left in this position. She was taught to hold the ball properly during the spin as you describe, but developed the bad habit anyway which is frustrating. We are very aware this is a major issue and think we are well on the way to quickly erasing it. She can fix it easy when she thinks about it and is now working to get her muscle memory right again, so no relapses will occur. I will upload some more videos after we have had a few weeks to get everything cemented right. It seems like it is a continual process to keep everything right and am hoping she will develop the attention to detail to start self policing her mechanics in the near future as maturity hopefully comes.

Thanks for all the help from everyone!!