Fastballs Good Enough for MLB

[Greenmonsters]

Their fastballs move, the minors is full of 95+ pitchers that have straight fastballs.

From what I've seen, the minors are home to pitchers that a) have a 95 mph fastball as their only pitch or b) can't consistently repeat their mechanics and spot their pitches. In fact, we see some of these pitchers in the majors each year, but only for a while.

 

[tmolina]

Wood bats versus composite bats.

Don't forget field dimensions too!!! Almost all college softball fields are 190-210ft....Pretty easy to hit homers with composite bats, alot of times on mishits too!

 

[SCDad]

MLB baseball's fastballs move late. There are a bunch of different kinds of fastballs in MLB, all designed to move the last 10 feet.

Softball fastballs don't move, period. Because of the shorter distance.

 

[GOINGDEEP]

MLB baseball's fastballs move late. There are a bunch of different kinds of fastballs in MLB, all designed to move the last 10 feet.

Softball fastballs don't move, period. Because of the shorter distance.

You make a valid point sir. But I believe the density and raised seams give the softball an advantage physically. I can assure you if a baseball had raised seams I'd have to wash my hands after every pitch......................cause I'd be throwing something VERY NASTY.

I've caught many a fastpitch girl, some CAN get a fastball to dance by simply adjusting the grip and axis a tad. ( like a cutter ) So again it raises the question...............is fastpitch really throwing "running fastballs" "sinking fastballs" and the old famous BB "rising fastball".

I sure wish we had PX data over a entire season of FP with multiple pitchers throwing multiple "announcer called" pitches to measure what they are really doing. Maybe in the future.

 

[Greenmonsters]

MLB baseball's fastballs move late. There are a bunch of different kinds of fastballs in MLB, all designed to move the last 10 feet.

Softball fastballs don't move, period. Because of the shorter distance.

Like GD noted, it depends on what you consider a fastball. Clearly the shorter distance preventing movement claim is invalid if you consider the rise and drop to be fastball variants.

Late break is a fallacy. Movement or break is a function of speed and spin. Other than a knuckleball, a pitch that moves or breaks begins to move or break as soon as it leaves the pitcher's hand. "Late" break is a visual/cognitive perception phenomenom - i.e., pitches don't go straight and then suddenly change path/trajectory, despite the ardent claims of announcers, hitters, coaches, pitchers, parents etc.

 

[starsnuffer]

Late break isn't a fallacy, it's a product of deceleration. Yes, the ball does not start to "drift more" in any direction, but its speed towards the batter decreases exponentially from drag as the ball approaches the batter while its drift speed (caused by spin that does not decelerate much in 60 feet) remains constant. That means that the ball might move 1" for the first 20' of travel but 4" for the last 20" establishing the perception of late break. Perception is reality, the rest is just physics (and our physics don't matter because they only exist in this multiverse, where as the plethora of other multiverse have completely different rules, so why bother learning them?)

-W

 

[RetiredCoach]

Major League Fastballs do change planes

In actuality, a major league fastball does change planes. The release point for a tall major league pitcher throwing from a raised mound can easily be 6.5 feet. If he throws a knee high fastball this could easily represent a change in planes of about 4 feet. This is different than a fastpitch fastball thrown from level ground that comes in relatively flat.

 

[Greenmonsters]

Late break isn't a fallacy, it's a product of deceleration. Yes, the ball does not start to "drift more" in any direction, but its speed towards the batter decreases exponentially from drag as the ball approaches the batter while its drift speed (caused by spin that does not decelerate much in 60 feet) remains constant. That means that the ball might move 1" for the first 20' of travel but 4" for the last 20" establishing the perception of late break. Perception is reality, the rest is just physics (and our physics don't matter because they only exist in this multiverse, where as the plethora of other multiverse have completely different rules, so why bother learning them?)

-W

W - Nice overview of the physics. Just trying to clarify that a ball doesn't travel straight then magically change direction "late".

In practice, a batter sees/reads the early speed and spin/break and then relies on the database of prior experiences stored in their brain to rapidly compute the swing path to intercept the projected ball flight at a later point in time when the ball is in the vicinity of the plate. If it were any easier, the average MLB hitters would hit better than .265-.270.

 

[SCDad]

Like GD noted, it depends on what you consider a fastball. Clearly the shorter distance preventing movement claim is invalid if you consider the rise and drop to be fastball variants.

Late break is a fallacy. Movement or break is a function of speed and spin. Other than a knuckleball, a pitch that moves or breaks begins to move or break as soon as it leaves the pitcher's hand. "Late" break is a visual/cognitive perception phenomenom - i.e., pitches don't go straight and then suddenly change path/trajectory, despite the ardent claims of announcers, hitters, coaches, pitchers, parents etc.

I completely understand this posters point, as with the others.

I call a fastball, a fastball, considered straight to me.

A drop ball, sure it is thrown as hard as possible, but still a drop ball. A curve ball, even when fast is a curve. Drop curve, the same. Screw ball, the same. Yeah the great pitchers can and will take something off a pitch at times. Then it is the pitch, but with some speed taken off.

The great pitchers hardly ever throw fastballs. It is always a variant thrown as hard as they can, which I do not consider a fastball.

It is the pitchers who can only throw fastballs, who get rocked. Until they get a great change, or learn to spin the ball on a couple different axis.

In my opinion, softballs need to spin, change planes, or similar to be effective. This alone is what makes the game so much different than baseball.

Baseball has split finger fastball (not softball), or two finger seam fastball (not softball). Maybe it is a definition thing?

 

[GOINGDEEP]

We have to remember ALL pitchers ( BB and FP ) who only throw straight fastballs get hammered pretty good. The difference that sets them apart for high level travelball, college or MLB is fastball movement. It's part of every high level evaluation right on the paperwork ( in my day ) or tablet today done by the scouts. The "movement" is achieved by different spin axis, some in MLB can achieve it with less than a 2 degree change and little to no loss of velocity. Not everyone can throw a fastball that moves, and then we must include superior speed of "said fastball", that's why only less than 1% of pitchers make it to the top ranks of both games.

One day a long study of PX will help us better understand what's really going on in FP.

Good thread full of good theories.