Evaluation in rec league

[Tad Higgins]

I have a question on how to run evaluations in a rec type league. The softball program is relatively new and has not been well organized over the years. Last year we got two great new commissioners who put us on the right track and we are looking for a better way to split the girls into teams.

how things are done now:

Every year there is a new evaluation day. Players are scored on a scale of 1-3 in the areas of hitting, throwing and fielding. Scores are added up, and teams are assigned by starting off with making sure that each team gets an equal number of girls who scored 8-9, 6-8, and so on. There are separate pitching/catching tryouts so that each team has at least one pitcher who can throw strikes and catchers who can at least stop the ball (these are also usually the players who score 8-9).

The problem that I personally have with this is that it first leaves too much up to a subjective coach's perspective, and second that the scale of 1-3 (with 2/3 of the score coming from 'defensive' skills) isn't very nuanced. A girl may crush the ball in the batting part, for example, when the coach is only lobbing them across the plate, but may have such bad mechanics that she would never hit a pitcher throwing 45-50mph.

So how do you evaluate players? Larger scale? different skills? subjective/quantitative? If you were to design an evaluation for a rec league with players ranging from TB quality to OMG, how would you do it?

I should also mention that coaches do not "pick" teams in a draft. The Board has determined that this is against the mission of the league and that evaluations must be held upon which time the commissioners divide up the teams. Players are also NOT supposed to automatically return to their previous year's team. Part of the mission of the league is to get the girls playing with different team mates year to year, not to have a bunch of teams that for cliques. These are things which we cannot change, although we can bend some of the rules in certain situations.

First, increase your rating range to at least 5. I use a 1-10 system (league gave me a 1-5 sheet that they use). Second, be honest. If the kid is a stud, indicate that with your answers. If the kid is bad, give 1's. Be honest. Also, give them enough good reps to show what they can do.

A draft is a must. If there are issues after the draft, the option to make a trade(s) is there. Don't let someone get you backed down and you take an unequal trade though!

 

[Jerseyman]

A method of choosing 'even' teams (no method is perfect) that I have found reasonably good is what I call a draft lottery. The coaches draft players based on evaluations/past season. Adjustments can then be made to balance the teams with the intent of making them as even as possible (pitchers/catchers). The catch is that once the coaches are satisfied that the teams are even, the coaches are randomly assigned their team based on a lottery. Accomodations need to be made for coaches daughter and possibly an assistant/daughter. When the coaches realize they could literally be assigned to any team, they are motivated to make sure the teams are even (and actually coach if they want to win). The Board or Commisioner can oversee the process and everyone needs to recognize that the goal is to limit the surprises and advantages any one coach may have based on their player knowledge or evaluations. The moment 'special' considerations are made then things will fall apart. I have seen Rec teams go undefeated as a result of 'ringers', riders who need to be on a particular coaches team, and unfortunate last minute/uninformed coaches taken advantage of. Under this type of system, the coaches are motivated to keep things even and the 'Good' Coaches (teacing, attitude, training, game savvy) can make a difference rather than 'outsmarting' the other coaches by stacking talent (ringers). If you can only win by overwhelming the other teams with better players, then travel or club ball is where you probably belong. Lopsided Rec teams can make for a very miserable experience for all concerned. Refine for your specific situation but recognize that the overall goal is even teams, with no one coach having an advantage/disadvantage based on talent. This system uses the selfish motive of the coaches (and their experience) to the benefit of all.

 

[CoogansBluff]

The goal is to have even teams. ... Having coaches draft and evaluate the players would imply that some coaches can evaluate and draft better which would lead to unbalanced teams which is not the goal.

I agree w/ your goal, and my experience w/ the draft matches yours. I'm not saying it's wrong to draft. If you can do one that generates even teams, then great. But too many times a draft is used a scapegoat. Coaches can't complain because they had their chance to evaluate and pick players, but it's the larger masses of players and families that we aim to please, not the coaches. I've run rec programs where I essentially picked the teams (with lots of feedback from coaches). But it was a small league, and I knew the players and coaches well enough and there was enough trust to pull it off. Every league is probably different. But I think you are right to bring up the pitfalls of a draft - some coaches are better at drafting than others, which can lead to very uneven teams.

 

[Jr10234]

My experience with LL:
requires Majors teams to be a draft, minors is set by location or random. Majors are usually 10-12 but stud 9's can make it.
Each team gets a pitcher in the first round. You have up through round 5 to pick your DD and AC DD. You cannot set AC beyond 1 for draft purposes. No shows at tryouts follow the draft order, randomly. If three girls don't show, each is assigned a random number and assigned in that order once all picks are made. The draft is a closed door session, trades must be agreed by both coaches and approved by the player agent.

Tryouts include:
Timed runs, home-1, home-2, home-home
Infield rotation:short and first then first to third. Two or three hits at each position then rotating
Outfield three hits: short, to a side, over
Hitting includes three bunt attempts and 5 additional pitches.

Inevitably we ended up with teams of very different caliber, one picked her former players, one picked based on the girls that would potentially play together for a few years, and the other got older girls. I was happy all my girls continued playing the following year and five went on to travel ball. Coaching made a big difference in rec, no matter how teams are determined I've never seen them equal.

Edited to add:same process is used for our 2-3 SB teams and 9-12 BB teams.

 

[CoogansBluff]

It's tough to complain about a team that you picked yourself as opposed to a team that is handed to you from "so-called" experts.

Yes, it's hard for the coach to complain. But are you trying to appease head coaches or the other 95 percent of people who show up to each of these games? I don't doubt that what you're doing in your league works. Not criticizing that. Just re-emphasizing an earlier point that I made - Is your goal to make teams even, thereby making it fair for all, or to develop a system that makes it hard for head coaches to complain?

 

[Coachmom]

It is absolutely not about appeasing coaches but in the 10 years that I have been a coach in my rec league I have yet to see a "balanced" division. We have had a blind draft system and we have had a coaches draft.
In the blind draft system there were always accusations of rigging the teams and still the teams were never even. There was always a dominant undefeated team in every level.
At least in the open draft coaches can see, evaluate players and make their pick based on whatever their criteria is as a coach.
Last season in our 12U we came as close to even teams as I have ever seen with coaches draft.

 

[cdolson00]

Is there really a perfect way of doing this. We are on the process of reevaluating the way we do this. I have looked for the best way, that provides coaches, players, parents and teams equal and fair. But I think I have a better chance of winning the lottery. right now we use outside evaluators and then teams were put together by our director and Comitioner. each coach got 5 picks besides there DD. I am not sure this is fair to new coaches because they don't know the girls. I am not complaining because I got the team I wanted but I am not sure I agree this is the best
process.

 

[Momo'sDad]

It is absolutely not about appeasing coaches but in the 10 years that I have been a coach in my rec league I have yet to see a "balanced" division. We have had a blind draft system and we have had a coaches draft.
In the blind draft system there were always accusations of rigging the teams and still the teams were never even. There was always a dominant undefeated team in every level.
At least in the open draft coaches can see, evaluate players and make their pick based on whatever their criteria is as a coach.
Last season in our 12U we came as close to even teams as I have ever seen with coaches draft.

Balance at 8u doesn't matter. It's player pitch with coach rescue and it's 8u. Parents get bent out of shape, but it's 8u. In the great scheme, it's doesn't matter if league officials cheat to stack an 8u team. But what it DOES impact is the feelings people have about your league. It makes them more likely to seek our greener pastures and you can lose potentially great volunteers because of it.

Even with the backdoor deals, we had a terrific 10u season last year. We had 2 fairly weak teams (1 coach didn't know the players, while the other wanted a friends & family team), but all the rest were competitive. No team was unbeatable and no team was undefeated.

Our league doesn't have enough talent above 10u to have much discussion about balance and it's unlikely it'll be an issue this year either.

Because of the existing softball culture, I do not see us moving away from coach draft anytime soon, but I do think the size of our league is a primary factor as well.

 

[CoogansBluff]

It is absolutely not about appeasing coaches but in the 10 years that I have been a coach in my rec league I have yet to see a "balanced" division. We have had a blind draft system and we have had a coaches draft.
In the blind draft system there were always accusations of rigging the teams and still the teams were never even. There was always a dominant undefeated team in every level.
At least in the open draft coaches can see, evaluate players and make their pick based on whatever their criteria is as a coach.
Last season in our 12U we came as close to even teams as I have ever seen with coaches draft.

I hear you. Was not criticizing your league. The larger your league, the harder it is to have even teams, IMO. In the league that I recently managed, we would have 4 teams max in 8U and 10U, and other divisions had fewer teams that played other parks. If it's that small, somebody is going to know the players well enough such that like-minded administrators and coaches (those genuinely interested in even teams) can figure out how to balance the teams with or without a draft. The key is knowledge of players - from having seen them play in previous seasons, not the tryout. But if you have a league of 300+ players, it's much harder to know what you've got. If I'm one of 10 coaches, I don't know the other teams and players that well. If I'm one coach out of 4 or fewer teams and we play each other 3-5 times, then I know all the players.

 

[Coachmom]

Momo...You are correct about the 8U too...Our league actually assigns teams to coaches at the 8U level so we are partially blind draft, partially coaches draft.

Coogan, we are a larger league last spring we had 9-6U teams...8-8U teams...6-10U teams...5-12U and 2 14U teams.

Personally, as a 12U volunteer coach with no daughter playing in the league any longer, part of the fun of coaching for me is picking my team. I am usually at a disadvantage because the other coaches are coming up through the ranks in their age divisions and therefore they know the players coming into the 12U division before I ever get to see them.

Last season my team came in 3rd of 5 so we were right in the middle of the pack winning 5 of our 10 games.