Something happened last weekend in a tournament my team was in that I don't know if I would have done the same or not. I was coaching my team in the Championship game of a NSA tourney. In the second inning (I was the team coming out of the winners side of the bracket, they had to beat us twice.) the other team had scored 4 runs and was up 5 to 1. During that inning something happened. We caught a fly ball in Left with a runner at second and third. The runner at third was tagging but the runner at second was all the way to third before she realized what happened. We threw the ball in to second got the out, here is where it gets weird. My second baseman turns to throw home, when she is shoved down by the runner trying to run back to second. Not ran into, but shoved down. I came out of the dug out all kinds of bent out of shape. Asking for appeal, the ruling was "Runner out at second, Runner out going home because of interference." The opposing coach went nuts. Stating you can't punish the runner for the interference, the run should score, or she should have to go back, but not the third out. As she argued, I just sit back and let them. Finally the UIC is called in. They call the coach in and give her the choice. Take the original call (which I find out later is not the right call) Both runners out. OR, runner is out at second, runner returns to third on dead ball because of unsportsmanlike conduct by runner at second and player is ejected from the game. Coach chose option 2. (Which I find out is the right call). The player was her #2 pitcher, First baseman and clean up hitter. We ended up winning 11-7, but I don't know what I would do if I was given those options. On one side the right call was the ejection, but if I was given the choice, would I have taken it, I don't know. What would you do?
Wwyd
- Thread starter indianafp
- Start date
Welcome to Discuss Fastpitch
Your FREE Account is waiting to the Best Softball Community on the Web.
I agree. The coaches claim "She didn't shove her." But they must have believed she did to take option 2.
Why was original call incorrect? If R1 scored after R2 pushed F4, correct call would be interference by a retired player and R1 would be called out as runner closest to home. The unsportsmanlike conduct is independent of the interference call and could also be assessed.
- Feb 3, 2011
- 1,880
- 48
I can't respond with regard to the rules, because I've never seen an NSA rulebook, but if I were given the choice of taking the out or an ejection of my #4 batter in the 2nd inning, then I'm taking the out.
If I believed that my player had been unsportsmanlike, however, I'd have no choice but to place her on the bench. I want the kids to play hard and demand it (even when I'm just a dad in the stands! lol), but it goes without saying that there's a distinct difference between playing hard and playing dirty, and the latter won't be tolerated.
I'm glad your umpires took the time to get the call right.
If I believed that my player had been unsportsmanlike, however, I'd have no choice but to place her on the bench. I want the kids to play hard and demand it (even when I'm just a dad in the stands! lol), but it goes without saying that there's a distinct difference between playing hard and playing dirty, and the latter won't be tolerated.
I'm glad your umpires took the time to get the call right.
According to the Umpires I have spoke with ASA and NSA. As soon as the runner pushed the player it is declared dead ball (for unsportsmanlike conduct). Then all runners must return to previous base, and the out given and the player ejected. That's how it was explained to me.
Unsportsmanlike conduct is a violation whose penalty is warning/ejection. Softball rules only award outs as restitution when a rule infraction prevented them from occurring.
In order to apply the proper rule(s), the umpire has to first determine if the act occurred before or after the runner was out or scored. The OP clearly said the runner was already out before she pushed the fielder, so the 'crash' rule (NSA 8-8t) does not apply - they can't call a retired runner out again. Interference by a retired runner (8-8s) is applicable if they prevented the defense from making a play on another runner.
The NSA rule book is available online - NSA 2014 Online Rulebook - Fastpitch
In order to apply the proper rule(s), the umpire has to first determine if the act occurred before or after the runner was out or scored. The OP clearly said the runner was already out before she pushed the fielder, so the 'crash' rule (NSA 8-8t) does not apply - they can't call a retired runner out again. Interference by a retired runner (8-8s) is applicable if they prevented the defense from making a play on another runner.
The NSA rule book is available online - NSA 2014 Online Rulebook - Fastpitch
- Aug 1, 2014
- 24
- 0
Id would have take the same choice this coach did, because that young lady would have been removed by me anyway from the game, and depending on how (borrow a basketball term) Flagrant the foul was, I might not let her play for a few more games either. Un-sportsman like conduct cannot be tolerated even if it costs the game
