calling pitches

[obbay]

DD's HS coach insists on having a coach call the pitches.

The AC (who I coach with on TB team) tells me everything and one thing he has been very upfront with is that this is new to him. he's seen other coaches do it effectively, and he enjoys doing it, especially with DD.
the problem I'm having is his pitch calling isn't that good (I'm hearing this from others, most recently a scout for another team) so he tries something, it doesn't work and DD gets blamed for it. (The HS Coach is big on placing blame on his players, but that's another story)

DD has been in an excellent pitching training program and knows the mental game and how to mix pitches. I'm thinking she would do better on her own.

i'm sure many of you have been in a similar position, what do you do when the pitcher might know better than the pitch-caller?
I know, it's only High School, but still....

 

[riseball]

It is a tough situation. Not too long ago catchers called the pitches, but that method is is now in the horse and buggy days of the game. With advances in the game it has been shown to be much more effective to have the pitch calling happen from the dugout. But the assumption is that the folks in the dugout know what they are doing. Unfortunately for your DD that does not appear to be the case. I would look to the catcher for some clarification on what is really happening. The question that needs to be answered is if your DD is executing her pitches? If she is, then the pitch caller is at fault. If not, then she needs to step up and own it. Remember that at all levels, pitch execution is far and away more important than pitch selection. Regardless of spin, pitches thrown on the edges of the zone rarely get hit hard. Fat pitches even with great spin tend to get hammered. Only by having the catcher provide continuous, objective feedback can the question of proper execution be answered. On my team whenever a pitch is struck hard my catchers provide immediate feedback. If they tap their facemask, the pitch was properly executed and I own it. If they rub their stomach the pitch was fat and the pitcher owns it.

 

[Phathead]

I think riseball nailed it. DD gets rocked she would look at me putting her index finger to her thumb with a small gap meaning a sarcastic I missed a little bit. Or she looked at me and small shrug of shoulders meant I hit the spot their at bat was better than my pitch. I feel the coaching calling pitch comes from a team playing a well coached team and their coach calling pitches and beating them badly. Defeated coach sees that and thinks he or she is just as good and decides to call pitches when that have no idea of what their doing. I have know doubt my DD can call a better game than HS coach

 

[Jack00]

I think riseball has it right. I went thru this with my daughter, and finally got her to understand that if she threw a flat riseball that got hammered and the 3rd baseman couldn't handle it, it wasn't all the fielders fault, or that the wrong pitch was called. She has to take responsibility also. Finally she has started to understand that she needs to hit the pitch that at is called at all times. It has made her a better pitcher and a pitcher that is a better teammate. She now appreciates her teammates when they bail her out with a good play when she missed her pitch and doesn't complain about them when they can't handle a hot shot off of one of her missed pitches. She also has started to understand also that if a teammate has a missed play she needs to bear down and bail her teammate out by getting out of the inning. That's what a team is, I have your back and you have mine.

 

[djcarter1966]

A couple things.

First you have to in practice be sure your pitcher can execute in other words pitch what your are calling...can't tell you how many coaches I see calling pitches for pitchers that don't have any control and could not hit spots being called 20% of the time.

Calling pitches against a team you have never seen and never scouted is fairly meaningless. Keep the ball low, come in and out, get a feel for the zone and then see what is working that day, maybe by the late innings (third time through which is when the pitcher needs some good advice) you can actually provide some meaningful input.

Communication is the most important thing, just one example if the coach want the drop ball low and inside but the ump is not giving that pitch you have three choices, throw the pitch for a ball (which is OK if you think hitter are swinging at it), bring up and out over the plate a little so it's called a strike (not a really good idea) or throw another pitch in another spot. The coach calling the pitches, the catcher and the pitcher all need to be on the same page and should touch base between every half inning how did it go this inning and who is up next inning. If your catcher really knows her stuff I think you could do just fine with her calling pitches with coach just doing a little scouting report especially in the late innings using spray chart from previous innings.

 

[riseball]

^^^^^ Like he said!

FWIW - When Jake has a pitch leave the yard she usually does not feel that bad about it. The very first batter she faced in a Gamecock uniform was Michigan's Sierra Romero. She came in with bases loaded and Romero at the plate. The result was a grand slam off a riseball up and away. A pitch that most humans would never swing at and few if any could ever hit. Romero clobbered it so kudos to her. To Jakes credit she decisively K's the next two to get out of the inning. The ones that she feels bad about is that cupcake down the middle to a .240 hitter that squeaks over the fence. Great hitters hit good pitches, that is what they do. When poor hitters hit the ball the pitcher usually has made a mistake. If you throw quality pitches and do not leave anything fat, you will probably have a good day.

 

[obbay]

Great feedback, thanks!
DD is pretty good at owning up to her mistakes.
Catcher likes for DD to decide what to throw, and they both tend to agree what works and what does not.
HS team never has any scouting Intel. Calling pitches every game is trial and error.

 

[JAD]

I tell my DD that if she hits her spots and a good batter hits a HR, give them a golf clap as they round the bases. If she missed her spot and hung it down the middle, that is on her.

 

[riseball]

Great feedback, thanks!
DD is pretty good at owning up to her mistakes.
Catcher likes for DD to decide what to throw, and they both tend to agree what works and what does not.
HS team never has any scouting Intel. Calling pitches every game is trial and error.

That said, unless you go way off the reservation with respect to location most coaches will never know if the pitcher and catcher are throwing what is actually called. If all goes well the coach will just sit back and take credit for their coaching genius none the wiser to the reality that surrounds them.

 

[djcarter1966]

^^^^was going to be my other suggestion, the only thing coach is really going to notice unless they really know what they are looking for and it sounds like OP coaches don't know...is high or low and the change up