How fast for a good riseball?

[Rocketech1]

You guys are better than that. You sound like Michelle Smith with her "sharp, late break" comments.

One of the things that makes this site so great is members like Java, Rick, BM, etc tell it like it is. Why would you guys purposely undermine their wisdom. Seems counter productive to me.

There was a time before I visited this site that I thought squish the bug and riseball's banana up as they reach the plate was reality but I'm glad they have educated me for the better.

 

[JJsqueeze]

this is the most boring "does a riseball rise" thread ever It's like watching the adult Channel at a Best Western. I'm just waiting for the good stuff to start and you two just won't show it.

 

[JJS]

You guys are better than that. You sound like Michelle Smith with her "sharp, late break" comments.

One of the things that makes this site so great is members like Java, Rick, BM, etc tell it like it is. Why would you guys purposely undermine their wisdom. Seems counter productive to me.

There was a time before I visited this site that I thought squish the bug and riseball's banana up as they reach the plate was reality but I'm glad they have educated me for the better.

Again, what does it matter? Yes, us coaches need to understand the difference, but the pitchers only need to know how to throw the effective pitch. IMO you are driving this point home for no reason. We all know and agree that the riseball doesn't rise. The difference is that we recognize that to the pitcher, catcher and batter it APPEARS to rise. Yes it is an illusion, but an effective one. I've caught a rise coming at me from mid 60s, and it fools you. Again, I'm not saying that you are wrong...I'm just saying that you keep screaming that the sky is blue, but we are talking about the color of the grass.

 

[Rocketech1]

Again, what does it matter? Yes, us coaches need to understand the difference, but the pitchers only need to know how to throw the effective pitch. IMO you are driving this point home for no reason. We all know and agree that the riseball doesn't rise. The difference is that we recognize that to the pitcher, catcher and batter it APPEARS to rise. Yes it is an illusion, but an effective one. I've caught a rise coming at me from mid 60s, and it fools you. Again, I'm not saying that you are wrong...I'm just saying that you keep screaming that the sky is blue, but we are talking about the color of the grass.

When someone says a riseball jumps over the bat they clearly don't understand that it doesn't. It's just very strange to me that you claim everyone knows this but they still say it rises and jumps when in fact it doesn't do anything close to that. Why not say it "flattens" out before it reaches home plate which is a lot more accurate description then the riseball jumps. It's like night and day difference. It's like saying the turnover drop and peel drop are two totally different pitches. Are we trying to educate people here or perpetuate myths? It's up to you.

 

[riseball]

When someone says a riseball jumps over the bat they clearly don't understand that it doesn't. It's just very strange to me that you claim everyone knows this but they still say it rises and jumps when in fact it doesn't do anything close to that. Why not say it "flattens" out before it reaches home plate which is a lot more accurate description then the riseball jumps. It's like night and day difference. It's like saying the turnover drop and peel drop are two totally different pitches. Are we trying to educate people here or perpetuate myths? It's up to you.

I agree with you but I don't think anyone in this thread claimed the ball jumps over the bat. Sometimes the message about what really matters is lost in the details. If you have ever frequented the Technical Hitting Forum you know all too well that there is a fine line between thoughtful discussion including the use of applied physics and a debate in the hallway of a Star Trek Convention.

 

[JAD]

Speaking of education...here is a great video that helps explain the Magnus effect.

 

[marriard]

but the pitchers only need to know how to throw the effective pitch. IMO you are driving this point home for no reason.

It is important for two reasons:

- When you understand what is actually happening and WHY it is happening, you can improve faster the right things. Understanding what you are doing is very important.
- these pitchers are the next group of coaches coming through the ranks and they will be teaching the next generation of pitchers. Many wont research what they are teaching and just teach what they were taught - even if it is incorrect - and even if it isn't what they actually do. That might not mater as much to the natural athlete, but it does matter to the player who NEEDS the best technique to succeed and needs to be taught the correct technique to have maximum success.

So yeah - it is important.

 

[JAD]

I agree with you but I don't think anyone in this thread claimed the ball jumps over the bat. Sometimes the message about what really matters is lost in the details. If you have ever frequented the Technical Hitting Forum you know all too well that there is a fine line between thoughtful discussion including the use of applied physics and a debate in the hallway of a Star Trek Convention.

Riseball "jump" describes the difference in the actual location of the ball vs. where your brain tells you the ball should be. That "difference" is what causes most people to "flinch" when catching it. Maybe Rocketech1 can petition to have the name of the pitch changed from "riseball" to "pitch that flattens outs"....

 

[Rocketech1]

Maybe Rocketech1 can petition to have the name of the pitch changed from "riseball" to "pitch that flattens outs"....

Or we can just call it "jumpball"?

 

[Greenmonsters]

Or we can just call it "jumpball"?

Can't call it a rising fastball cuz fastballs aren't allowed by fastpitch coaches