Another Look Back ruling question

[tlester3672]

I watched a different situation play out and I wanted to get other peoples take on it. We had a runner on third. Our batter hits a ball to the opposing 3rd baseman that bobbles it and doesn't attempt a throw. Our runner rounds first, several feet off the bag, and is looking back to see where the ball is. The third baseman throws it to the pitcher, who is in the circle. Our runner, still with her eye on the pitcher, starts to sidestep her way back towards first base. The pitcher rotates quickly towards first base and jerks her arm up in a motion as if to throw it to first. Our runner, thinking she is getting picked off, immediately takes off for second base, since she took her motion as a continuation of a live ball play. The pitcher threw the ball to second and had our runner in a pickle. She retreated towards first and the second baseman made an errant throw over the first baseman's head. This allowed the runner to advance to second and our runner on third to score. No call was made during all this action. Then after the runner was safe on second base and home, the home plate umpire calls the runner out on the look back rule at second and sent the runner back to third. Is this right? Our runner wasn't just standing there baiting a throw. She was actively going back to first base when the pitcher, who couldn't even see where she was because her back was to her, spun and pulled her arm up to throw to first. If she had, she would have definitely picked off our runner and she had no choice but to take off for second, so she was out either way if this ruling is correct.

 

[bmakj]

arm up poised to throw is "attempting a play", LBR is off, bad call. results should have stood

 

[canyonjoe]

From this description it seems like they should not have called LBR and play should have stood.

 

[mmeece]

The only way I could see LBR applying is if the umpire said her initial "sidesteps her way back to 1B" was not immediately or continuously returning to 1B. Otherwise, sounds like the attempted/fake throw to 1B should have removed the LBR.

 

[tlester3672]

The only way I could see LBR applying is if the umpire said her initial "sidesteps her way back to 1B" was not immediately or continuously returning to 1B. Otherwise, sounds like the attempted/fake throw to 1B should have removed the LBR.

Possibly that is what he was thinking. When she came off the field I asked her about it and she said that she was not stalling. She was continuously moving towards first base. She said she was not the fastest baserunner but she was a very smart one that knows the rules and when the pitcher spun around to throw at her, she was well aware that the ball was live and she could go either way.

 

[tlester3672]

I did not here anyone say it but I assume as the ball was on the way to the pitcher, someone informed her that the runner was well off the base. The pitcher caught the ball in the circle, transferred to her throwing hand, and immediately spun with her arm up to throw. I don't think she does that without knowing that our runner still has a ways to go to get back to first.

 

[Westwind]

Here is the short version of the elements of the look back rule, (LBR).

The look back rule (delay) is in effect when the pitcher has the ball in the circle and the batter runner has reached first base.

When those elements exist, LBR is “on”. Base runners must be moving toward the next base or back to their last base.

The LBR can be shut off by some common things like an “attempt” by the pitcher (who has the ball in the circle) or by the pitcher walking outside the circle with the ball.

So- in this case, the pitcher shut off LBR by making a fake which is an attempt. I would say the LBR is then turned back “on” by the runner doing anything besides proceeding directly to one base or another?

Umpires what am I missing here.

 

[flash277]

Here is the short version of the elements of the look back rule, (LBR).

The look back rule (delay) is in effect when the pitcher has the ball in the circle and the batter runner has reached first base.

When those elements exist, LBR is “on”. Base runners must be moving toward the next base or back to their last base.

The LBR can be shut off by some common things like an “attempt” by the pitcher (who has the ball in the circle) or by the pitcher walking outside the circle with the ball.

So- in this case, the pitcher shut off LBR by making a fake which is an attempt. I would say the LBR is then turned back “on” by the runner doing anything besides proceeding directly to one base or another?

Umpires what am I missing here.

This is a good question, I never thought of it like that.

 

[Westwind]

I have a hard time remembering rules

It helps when I break them down into parts or “the elements”.

 

[CoachJ5513]

when the pitcher raised her arm to simulate a throw, the LBR was immediately "off" and the runner may choose either direction. However, if the pitcher lowered her hand and did not make a throw, it is again "in effect" at which time the runner must advance directly to one base or the other. My biggest issue would be that the LBR is a "dead ball out" It should have been called immediately when the baserunner changed directions.... right?