When did your pitchers increase velocity?

[CoachJD]

I've been thinking about this for a while. I haven't been around a ton of different pitchers, but my unscientific feeling is that I don't know very many who made massive velocity increases during their high school years. While I think a lot of those 12u pitchers throwing 65 are just radar gun myths, I also can't think of any pitchers I saw throwing 50 as a Freshman who were at 65 as a Senior. I'm sure they exist! They must. That's the point of this post. I'm trying to figure out how often pitchers make big strides later.

Let's assume a few things.

1) I'm not talking about pitchers who start pitching very late. Let's say the pitcher started pitching in the 8-12 range.
2) I'm not talking about pitchers who have made a massive change to their mechanics (HE to IR) that can explain a big jump
3) I am talking about pitchers who most would look at and say "pretty good mechanics." Nobody's mechanics are perfect, of course, but I'm talking those girls you see and you just know she's a pitcher.

At what age did you see the biggest jumps in velocity for your pitchers?

Were those gains connected to obvious growth spurts/puberty?

How often have you seen a pitcher throwing 51-52 as a Freshman (again, with solid if not perfect mechanics) who found a way to 60-65 by Senior year?

And a question that's probably harder: How can you project an eventual top speed? What do you look for? Baseball scouts can, with varying degrees of accuracy (and possibly nothing scientific), look at a teenager and project an additional x mph based on body size, fixing certain flaws, etc.

 

[Chilixa]

From what I have observed it has a lot to do with at what age a girl matures physically. Some girls are nearly fully developed at 12 and others 16. I think a year or so after puberty you would likely stop seeing the huge gains you can see in a year. After that training and continued strength with training probably can provided a few mph a year.

I think when you are projecting speed down the road you tend to look towards genetics. How big are the parents. How much room to add weight does their frame have. What size will the player be when she has fully matured.


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[4Martini]

I think when you are projecting speed down the road you tend to look towards genetics. How big are the parents. How much room to add weight does their frame have. What size will the player be when she has fully matured.

I’m curious what you see with adding weight. I have a 5’9” 14yo who is a bean pole.

 

[Chilixa]

I’m curious what you see with adding weight. I have a 5’9” 14yo who is a bean pole.

I have one also. Mine is just 5’8”. I think width of shoulders is a big one when people project future weight. Width of hips after puberty as well.

I certainly have had no issues adding weight the last few years! But I am guessing it will be more difficult for my DD. My wife and I are always curious what size we think our DD will end up by the end of high school. I am 6’1” and my wife is 5’11”. Our DD may grow some more or she may almost be done. It is hard to predict on any kid, even your own when you have a lot of information.


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[lostcreek1]

I think length of arms really has more effect on speed than weight does. Not saying weight doesn't matter, just not as much as having long levers. From a place that gives lessons this is the average of two years of all the girls that take lessons there. 8u=32 10u=40 12u=48 14u=52 16u=55 18u=59 This was the fastest in each age group. 8u=43 10u=51 12u=56 14u=67 16u=62 18u=65 that 67 in 14u is kind of an outlier the next fastest in 14u was 60. From this you can kind of see how the average and top end girls progressed per age group.

 

[angispeds]

I have one also. Mine is just 5’8”. I think width of shoulders is a big one when people project future weight. Width of hips after puberty as well.

I certainly have had no issues adding weight the last few years! But I am guessing it will be more difficult for my DD. My wife and I are always curious what size we think our DD will end up by the end of high school. I am 6’1” and my wife is 5’11”. Our DD may grow some more or she may almost be done. It is hard to predict on any kid, even your own when you have a lot of information.


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Kids usually end up somewhere between their parents. Mid parental height would subtract 5 inches from dad and average with mom as a guesstimate which would put her close to 5ft 10. Another thought is girls typically add about 2 inches after they start their period. Your doctor should have a growth curve on her that is good at guessing as well.


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[CoachJD]

I think length of arms really has more effect on speed than weight does. Not saying weight doesn't matter, just not as much as having long levers. From a place that gives lessons this is the average of two years of all the girls that take lessons there. 8u=32 10u=40 12u=48 14u=52 16u=55 18u=59 This was the fastest in each age group. 8u=43 10u=51 12u=56 14u=67 16u=62 18u=65 that 67 in 14u is kind of an outlier the next fastest in 14u was 60. From this you can kind of see how the average and top end girls progressed per age group.

Interesting. Our Freshman pitcher sits at 51-52 (she was clocked at 53-54 consistently for one game, but all that did was confirm for me that gun is juiced, which I've long suspected). She doesn't turn 15 until next month.

Her parents are both around 6. She's... maybe 5'6"? Bigger girl, but not overly heavy. Based on her older sister, I don't know if she's going to get much taller. She definitely could stand to get stronger though. She has a solid build, but I don't know how much strength she's added through working out.

She has some room for improvement with her drive/front-side resistance, but not 10 mph worth. I'm curious how much more velocity she has room to add through mechanical adjustments and how much will have to be through becoming stronger/more athletic.

It's nice to see there should be some natural progression over the next few years.

 

[Northball]

Interesting. Our Freshman pitcher sits at 51-52 (she was clocked at 53-54 consistently for one game, but all that did was confirm for me that gun is juiced, which I've long suspected). She doesn't turn 15 until next month.

Her parents are both around 6. She's... maybe 5'6"? Bigger girl, but not overly heavy. Based on her older sister, I don't know if she's going to get much taller. She definitely could stand to get stronger though. She has a solid build, but I don't know how much strength she's added through working out.

She has some room for improvement with her drive/front-side resistance, but not 10 mph worth. I'm curious how much more velocity she has room to add through mechanical adjustments and how much will have to be through becoming stronger/more athletic.

It's nice to see there should be some natural progression over the next few years.

One thing I've noticed is a jump when they are able to put things together. The timing comes together, the resistance becomes strong, the whip engages, and consequently they look smooth in their delivery. It takes less work to deliver a pitch and it looks like it.

 

[injnyr]

My oldest DD has experienced a few speed growth periods:

She was throwing 52 at 12.5 yo and when she turned 13 hit 57.

Then she slowed down due to stretching out, going back down to 52 at 13.5 yo to a high of 58 at 14 yo.

Vertical growth looks to be done and she added weight at 14.5 yo throwing 58 to getting up to 62 at 15 yo.

This past year she has really focused on weight training to raise her average to 60-62, with a peak of 63 at 15.5 yo. If she keeps working, I think she can go up at least 5 more mph. I say this because there are still some obvious mechanical fixes to be made.

Size-wise, she's now a hair over 5'6" at 130 lbs. Looking to bulk up to at least 140 lbs by the fall (for varsity basketball) and likely top out at no more than 5'7". She is lean and muscular, has long limbs (both arms and legs), and has big hands.

It really came together for her when we focused on body movements, connectedness & timing, and staying relaxed rather than trying to muscle it in and be forced. She's got sneaky speed, very fluid calm movements, almost a "playing catch" intensity, but when the front leg goes into the ground the loose arm whip accelerates and shoots the ball out with lots of spin.

Now the rest of her siblings are benefitting from her being the guinea pig...

 

[PJR202]

From what I've seen and a lot of video, by 11th grade or so, most average pitchers with average genetics, average mechanics, and no whip, will peak in the mid 50's. Ones who started pitching late, such as my daughter, may not peak for another year. She's a sophomore and been at it for 4 years and is only just now to 50. She doesn't whip yet, which is mostly my fault (ok, entirely probably), so her gains have mostly come from reps and the strength that has come with growth. If we can get whip happening this offseason (gonna take her to an instructor with more experience than me), I think realistically she can end up in the 55-57 range in her senior year. She has very average genetics and is like 5'5, 140lbs.

Higher level pitchers with average to good genetics, really solid mechanics, and no whip, are hitting high 50's by 10th grade or so, and done. A lot of these girls are more robust in build and have better than average strength/explosivity.

Pitchers pushing well past 60 have good to above-average genetics (fast twitch movement and well above average height) and really solid mechanics with whip. Their speed gains are found in the small things. The heavy video and 4D motion analysis, stretch and mobility, isolated muscle strengthening and strength balance, fascial manipulation, utilizing spiral lines, etc. And this kind of stuff involves very high level and detailed pitching coaches.

Your montana, monica, etc, have all these things plus tremendous height.