Weight back or weight forward

[mosftballdad]

DD (14U) recently switched from peel drop to roll over drop. She just couldn't get the release on the peel drop. Her PC teaches weight over front foot at release and so does one of her current coaches who pitches for a local DII school. She went to a pitching clinic within the organization last week and the coach there teaches weight over the back foot. DD said having the weight back was easier to throw but her PC doesn't think that is the most effective way to throw the roll over drop. Her team coach throws it effectively and can make adjustments to batter's positions in the box and she contributes that to the weight forward release.

I am interested in hearing what others experiences are with the pitch in relation to either weight over front foot or weight back. If you have a video to "prove" your point, even better.

 

[FP26]

DD's first pitching coach also taught weight over the front foot. Current pitching coach wants her weight distribution to be the same as her fastball. The only difference is the amount of I/R she achieves. I have not personally heard anyone teach weight over the back foot for the drop, but I am not an expert. I have heard weight over the back foot for the rise ball...

 

[Rick Pauly]

Weight into the front foot/leg is a more correct postural statement .....this will enable the pitcher to maintain front side resistance. Weight over the front foot gives connotations of the pitcher being totally stickman-like vertical at release.....I see this method used by many pitchers and they all appear to be robotic and stiff...this is affectionately referred to as Pogo-Sticking.
IMO, weight over the back foot is a mechanically incorrect method of teaching any pitch.....note that the back toe is dragging forward as the pitchers hand moves into the release zone.....it can drag like this because there is very little weight on the back foot.
The weight distribution in pitching is very similar to hitting.....and you don't see elite hitters with their weight on the back foot or on top of their front foot standing vertical at time of contact.
The reason for the "weight over the front foot" method is to raise the release point of the ball......raising the release point is a good thing but it is better done after front foot landing by allowing the upper torso to "hinge at the waist" and move into a near vertical posture....that way the pitcher can still maintain front side resistance with the landing leg.

The above two pics show body position at landing (into the front foot/leg) and then upper torso hinging at the waist to get to near vertical.

 

[FP26]

As I was thinking about this more, I believe her first PC explained it as "weight forward", rather than "weight over front foot" for the drop. I misquoted her there. Likewise, she taught the rise ball as "weight back". As she would demonstrate the pitches, her upper body (above the waist) would just be tilted slightly forward or backward depending on the pitch she was teaching at the time.

 

[Jojo]

My DD always struggled with the rollover drop, she was a predominately rise ball/screwball pitcher and never really threw the drop.

She tried and tried and just could not get her weight forward to throw the drop.

Her last PC was able to switch her over to a peel-over drop that she could throw weight back. It worked good for her because everything she threw was weight back, so there was nothing to telegraph her drop.

 

[lhowser]

The above two pics show body position at landing (into the front foot/leg) and then upper torso hinging at the waist to get to near vertical.

Rick thank you for posting the pictures. Look at how early she released the ball on the drop. I have been told by several good coaches that the early release point actually a key to the drop.

The weight forward I had presumed was to change the hip angle and raise the release point allowing the pitcher to throw a bit downhill. This doesn't seem as much to be the case the the images of Sarah.

 

[sleepwalker]

I know this is off topic from the OP, but I would like to throw my in my $.02.

Why abandon the peel drop for the rollover? Why not work on both?

Here's my reasoning.

Last Sunday night, I was watching game two in the 2013 Super Regionals between Nebraska and Oregon with my dd. 2013 PAC 12 Pitcher of the Year for Oregon was throwing a steady diet of two pitches. Peel drop, thrown around 70 mph, and roll over drop thrown between 64 - 66 mph. As we sat watching the game and watching the little yellow radar number pop up after every pitch, we had a very good conversation about changing speeds of pitching. As I sat with my 18yr dd who is in her Sr. year of High School, she looked over at me and said that she would like to try throwing a series like that.

Our original intent for watching the game was to watch what the college elite pitchers were doing and what kind of a pitch selection were they doing. The gal from Oregon threw a steady dose of drop balls and did a great job of changing speeds and spin. As I watched the game, I looked at my dd and said, we got to get back to throwing the peel and the roll over. I thought it was a great game to watch because sometimes her overzealous dad(me) tries to overthink the game and strategy. I think that if my dd's roll over breaks more than her peel drop, that the roll over is only drop for my dd. After watching that Oregon pitcher use both drop balls effectively, even a bucket dad like me can look at my dd and say, "Hey, there is an example of an elite pitcher changing the speeds of her pitches."

 

[starsnuffer]

Be careful using the "weight back" analogy. Hitting instructors use this incorrectly all the time. What you're really trying to figure out is the angle you want the torso and stride leg at release. The back leg should be relatively weightless at this point, just as it is in hitting at contact.

-W

 

[humpty]

Is it possible the peel was her fastball?

I know this is off topic from the OP, but I would like to throw my in my $.02.

Why abandon the peel drop for the rollover? Why not work on both?

Here's my reasoning.

Last Sunday night, I was watching game two in the 2013 Super Regionals between Nebraska and Oregon with my dd. 2013 PAC 12 Pitcher of the Year for Oregon was throwing a steady diet of two pitches. Peel drop, thrown around 70 mph, and roll over drop thrown between 64 - 66 mph. As we sat watching the game and watching the little yellow radar number pop up after every pitch, we had a very good conversation about changing speeds of pitching. As I sat with my 18yr dd who is in her Sr. year of High School, she looked over at me and said that she would like to try throwing a series like that.

Our original intent for watching the game was to watch what the college elite pitchers were doing and what kind of a pitch selection were they doing. The gal from Oregon threw a steady dose of drop balls and did a great job of changing speeds and spin. As I watched the game, I looked at my dd and said, we got to get back to throwing the peel and the roll over. I thought it was a great game to watch because sometimes her overzealous dad(me) tries to overthink the game and strategy. I think that if my dd's roll over breaks more than her peel drop, that the roll over is only drop for my dd. After watching that Oregon pitcher use both drop balls effectively, even a bucket dad like me can look at my dd and say, "Hey, there is an example of an elite pitcher changing the speeds of her pitches."

 

[mosftballdad]

Thanks everyone for your responses. I figured I had used the wrong terminology in describing the weight distribution. Weight forward is what her PC talks about. We abandoned the peel because she just couldn't get it...no matter how much we worked on it. The roll over has been a better pitch for her.

I haven't had a chance to talk to her coach about how she throws her drop in relation to the batters position in the box. How would you teach/describe it to your pitcher?