Guest playing protocols

[whiporee]

I'm spinning this off the Hissy Quits thread, because I think it brings up an interesting set of questions about guest playing.

I've got two sets of questions, i guess. The first is as a player/parent, what are your expectations when it comes to guest playing? Do you think if you are invited to play, you should play, period, or do you see yourself/your Dd as just there to help out if needed? Does it matter how far you traveled for the tourney -- if you're a local who got picked up, should you have different expectations than if you're a peer of the team, ie you traveled with them to someplace out of state? Does it matter if you know the team already? Do you have conversations witht eh coach beforehand, or are you/your DD just happy for another chance to play?

Secondly, as a coach who is bringing in guest players. How much responsibility do you feel to them? Do you feel more responsibility to your own team, or to the girl who is making a sacrifice (?) to help you out? If you have a guest player who is clearly better than your own player at a position, are you inclined to play them over your own? And if you do, how do you justify it to your team? Does it matter to you if you invited them, or if they sought you out (responding to a Facebook post you made about needing players, for example)?

We've had a mix. Because we live in Colorado, DD got the chance to play with a team from Florida for Sparkler who posted on Facebook they needed a pitcher. I wrote them and they were thrilled to have an emergency arm. When they saw her pitch, they weren't overly impressed, but they were very nice the whole time, put her in to pinch run a few times during pool play. Then they had one of their players get hurt and another left early, so when it got to bracket play she was their starting first baseman -- made it to the semifinals, so she ended up playing every inning of five straight games (no errors, I'm proud to say). So that was three days of doing nothing and then two days of full time -- and interesting mix. But she's also guest pitched for a few local teams, and has had a couple of tourneys where she was invited and then barely got in at all.

For our team, our coach goes out of her way to reward guest players. We've recruited local pitchers when we've been shorthanded out of time, and she always makes sure they get at least a start if not more. And she's not been hesitant to start a guest over one of her own -- not because she thinks the guest is better, but to show her appreciation for them coming out. Not sure how I feel about that, so I thought I'd toss out what other folks feelings were about these strangers who occasionally invade our teams

 

[CMMom1740]

My opinion only (parent, not coach):

1. Only pick up players if you need them. Not just to have warm bodies on the bench in case of injury. Unless you clearly communicate that the guest player should not expect to play unless someone has to sit out unexpectedly (in which case, why would anyone agree to do that?).

2. If you have a guest player, play them. Doesn't have to be every game or every inning, but use them. Especially pitchers and catchers. Let them know in advance whether they can expect to see playing time during pool vs. bracket games. This is particularly true if the guest player will be traveling and spending money for hotel, food, etc...

3. If you pick up girls for the weekend or longer, introduce them to the rostered players and parents by email in advance. It really sucks to walk into a tournament and have parents and players be hostile to you and it sucks as a rostered player to be surprised by a guest player who plays your position while you are perfectly well and fine to play.

4. For the love of Pete, don't bring in "ringers" just to win a plastic trophy and bench your rostered players. If your players aren't good, COACH and DEVELOP them. No round robin of guest players while the paying rostered players sit.

The majority of problems can be prevented through communication. Coaches communicate with guest players about what they can expect and also with rostered players re: your intentions (is this really just a guest player or is she likely to become rostered and knock someone out of their position).

I'm sure there are others. This is what comes to mind. I've been on both sides of this fence many times as a parent.

 

[Strike2]

DD guested several times this year. I always ask up front whether she's there to fill a specific hole or as depth. If it's a local tournament and I just want her to get a few extra reps somewhere, I'm not as concerned about her playing time as when we're traveling. The more travel and cost, generally the higher playing reward I expect, and I clarify expectations for both sides up front.

Bottom line: I expect DD the pickup player to play...a lot. If she's not playing, then we don't have much reason to be there. However, I start to get uncomfortable if I see DD playing to the detriment of a regular. If that regular's earlier absence is why DD was needed in the first place, my concern vanishes. If the coach is rotating the bench and everyone is sitting more or less the same, that's OK as well.

I see teams stack pickups on top of already full lineups this time of year. I'm not talking about a critical need such as a replacement pitcher or catcher, but position players. That would be reason for me to both pass as a pickup, and to look for another regular team.

 

[HunterMO]

DD is a pitcher (who can hit) and typically is why she's sought after for fill in. Either a team is down one of theirs or they're looking for a little depth over a long weekend. I always ask up front what the teams expectation is of her. Regular rotation vs as needed. And whether they will want her to play infield or hit throughout the tournament. So far we've had very positive experiences. I don't ever expect DD to play every inning or hit any higher than bottom spot of the lineup. She's a fill in. The regular team is the HC's priority.

As for finding fill ins....we've had to do that a fair amount this year. We only had two pitchers and one catcher this year. For league play that's fine. Out of a 14-girl roster, we typically would end up with 7-9 for tournaments. It was just that kind of year for us. So adding one or two (pitcher & catcher) wasn't much of an issue. We would be up front about their use and it was pretty easy to get them playing time.

We are playing a one-day tournament this Saturday and originally only had 7 of our girls available. So we added two fill ins. One utility and one pitcher/utility. I was upfront with the pitcher fill-in saying our two would get priority for pitching and that she was there incase of injury. But that she'd see fielding time and would hit. Her Dad was okay with that. One more of our girls became available and so we'll have 10 total. Which, to me, is a good number for a hot one-day tournament.

 

[Rule#6]

it confounds me why any parent would tolerate their paying DD sitting the bench while a guest player plays their position.

 

[YOCOACH]

I've been on both sides of the fence. As a parent, my DD filled in just about every weekend we were off for somebody or another back when she played TB. Some teams she played almost as much as the rest of the team players, sometimes she never even got to see the field because she was there JIC and sometimes she was there because she was better than the players the team had and played almost every inning. If she didn't see the field, she wouldn't return the following day. If she played every inning because she was better than the players they had, she would leave after the first game. Those were her personal rules she made up and followed, not ours.

As a coach, I only pick up subs when absolutely necessary and when I do, I treat and play them as I would any of my other team members. I feel if they were nice enough to volunteer their off time to help out my team, the least I can do is play them. They may not get the exact same playing time as my regular players but it would be close.

I remember those teams that called in a sub (my daughter) and never played her. I remember Every. Single. One. by name, even years later. I also remember that she never subbed for those teams ever again either. Eventually, it got to the point where many of those teams couldn't find a sub and had to start withdrawing from tournaments. I refuse to be one of those teams.

The long and short of it is this. Those sub players are there to help out your team when it's in need. They are also there to get playing time and developmental time. Play them to reward them. I'm not saying every inning. I'm not saying starting them in place of your regular players. But at least make it so they had fun, got some PT and want to come back and sub for you again.

 

[Tide_will_Roll]

My opinion only (parent, not coach):

1. Only pick up players if you need them. Not just to have warm bodies on the bench in case of injury. Unless you clearly communicate that the guest player should not expect to play unless someone has to sit out unexpectedly in which case, why would anyone agree to do that?).

2. If you have a guest player, play them. Doesn't have to be every game or every inning, but use them. Especially pitchers and catchers. Let them know in advance whether they can expect to see playing time during pool vs. bracket games. This is particularly true if the guest player will be traveling and spending money for hotel, food, etc...

3. If you pick up girls for the weekend or longer, introduce them to the rostered players and parents by email in advance. It really sucks to walk into a tournament and have parents and players be hostile to you and it sucks as a rostered player to be surprised by a guest player who plays your position while you are perfectly well and fine to play.

4. For the love of Pete, don't bring in "ringers" just to win a plastic trophy and bench your rostered players. If your players aren't good, COACH and DEVELOP them. No round robin of guest players while the paying rostered players sit.

The majority of problems can be prevented through communication. Coaches communicate with guest players about what they can expect and also with rostered players re: your intentions (is this really just a guest player or is she likely to become rostered and knock someone out of their position).

I'm sure there are others. This is what comes to mind. I've been on both sides of this fence many times as a parent.

My daughter's former coach broke every one of these "rules" except for #2. He especially enjoyed breaking #4.

 

[FP26]

As an ex-coach, we only picked up guest players if we didn't have at least 10 players available. 10 was my magic number. Before the player even accepted the spot as a guest, I would tell them that they would be treated just like any other player on the team. They would play a lot, but would also sit once in a while. They were part of the team, at least for that weekend. I also explained this to the parents before the first tournament. They knew my rules, and we were consistent with them.

DD also guested quite often for other teams, and how much she was used varied. As a pitcher, she would typically guest as a pitcher only. So she may sit a game or two and then pitch a full game. Or she would pitch a few innings in relief in multiple games. Some teams would also use her in the field or at bat when she wasn't pitching. It really varied based on the team, and it wasn't an issue for her either way.

She only had one problem guesting that I can remember. Another team asked her to guest because one of their pitchers was not available. She accepted and showed up as requested. When she arrived, she learned that the person that wasn't going to be available actually showed up. Apparently she heard that DD was coming to guest, got upset, and changed her plans. DD split the day at 1b and 3b. She talked to the coach after the games were over. She suggested that she not return for Sunday, because of the situation, but if the coach wanted her there, she would be there. The coach appreciated her willingness to help. She guested for them several more times after this incident. The other girl ended up moving to another team, and then another...

 

[radness]

Some Coaches get weird about last minute tweeks to try and find a magical fix.
Darn hard part of being a guest is that one time you go show up,
IS THE FIRST IMPRESSION,
For that it seems there will undoubtedly be unavoidable junk sometimes.

 

[clarity]

Does any of this change if the subs in question are "next year's" new player on the team?