Discipline

[4 girl's dad]

Quote Originally Posted by sportpsych_consultant View Post
Exercise as a discipline tactic isn't particularly useful because it creates negative feelings towards fitness and exercise. Yelling and terror are only short-term answers but you lose respect. And benching is not a useful route because most people (especially teens) cannot make the connection between "I was acting up in practice and that is why I am sitting on the bench" even if you tell them. The best tactic I've used with athletes is asking a simple question "who wants to be here". Then the follow up question is "why are we here and what are we here to do?" It's a simple and clam way of interacting with your athletes. Also, instead of talking AT them you are having a conversation. Pulling at what motivates people can really change behavior.

"I just threw up in my mouth a little."


While I understand your point Sports Psych, I also understand CB and Eastons comments as well. It does come across a little, well, wussy. (Nothing personal) I believe that the goals have to be set up front and usually repeated often, especially to younger players. "Do you want to be here?" "Why are you here?" "What are your goals of being here?" They are all very good questions and need to be answered. But sometimes, there has to be punishment of some sort whenever they are making consistent mistakes, deviating from the goals and to the why are you here. A little "extra practice" and a mildly raised voice to show displeasure of the coach is also needed to motivate the player IMO. Otherwise she is not going to reach her personal and team goals and she will not get better.

I do believe the kids have to get in the zone when they are on the dirt. How to consistently do this is the million dollar question.

 

[SAMBU101010]

Tell them you are going to request that their parents take their phones from them!!! THat will shape them up!!!

 

[CoogansBluff]

I liked what Sportpsych had to say. Not sure why it was off-putting to some.

Let’s review.

Exercise as a discipline tactic isn't particularly useful because it creates negative feelings towards fitness and exercise.

This opinion has been expressed on this forum many times. Nothing new or controversial.

Yelling and terror are only short-term answers but you lose respect.

Agree.

And benching is not a useful route because most people (especially teens) cannot make the connection between "I was acting up in practice and that is why I am sitting on the bench" even if you tell them.

I don’t agree that benching doesn't work here, but I do agree that teens often have trouble understanding why their playing time is going down, especially if it has to do with practice habits and not game performance. So I think he has a point. You might find playing time alone will not solve the problem, not without having a candid two-way conversation with the player. IMO, many players are conditioned not to question playing time, just be a team player and do what the coach tells them to do. I can think of examples on DD’s team this year where players seemed largely oblivious about lineup decisions. Something to consider.

The best tactic I've used with athletes is asking a simple question "who wants to be here". Then the follow up question is "why are we here and what are we here to do?" It's a simple and clam way of interacting with your athletes. Also, instead of talking AT them you are having a conversation. Pulling at what motivates people can really change behavior.

It’s important to hear his objective, not what some might interpret as a softy coach having a group hug. The key point I got is this – If you value effort and attitude, then make it a priority by talking about it and coaching it and by spending time on it. That’s opposed to assuming that kids are going to give 100 percent, then punishing it when it doesn’t occur. If you want your team's trademark to be attitude and effort, you have to devote time to it. This poster wants to talk about it at every practice and involve the players in that rather than giving a speech. I like that.

 

[Cannonball]

Exercise as a discipline tactic isn't particularly useful because it creates negative feelings towards fitness and exercise.


While this has been discussed on this site, there are some, including me that have said that we sometimes stop drill work etc. and have our players run some distance, not long, but to make a point and get our players to focus more. For me, it very definitely works. As I've posted here before, if I punish any other way, I run as well. IMO, that actually builds team bonding.

Yelling and terror are only short-term answers but you lose respect.

I am a major yeller. In fact, I'm betting you have never seen anyone comparable. Yet, talk to any player I've coached and they will tell you that they not only understood the yelling but thought of it as me competing. I am reminded of one time when I took my JV Basketball Team to a tournament and we were playing a team that would win a state championship later in the year. I was admonished by my administration and told that I was not to yell. Well, that didn't work too well earlier in the tournament and so, the administration came to keep me in check. We were down by 2 points with 4 seconds left in the game. Aaron Panell begged me to yell at them. He then turned to my bosses sitting behind our bench and said that if I could yell they'd win the tournament. As with discipline itself, you can't just yell. You have to make deposits in the bank before you take a withdrawal. I do so by getting after it with my players, by taking an interest in them off the court and by being straight forward and up front with them.

And benching is not a useful route because most people (especially teens) cannot make the connection between "I was acting up in practice and that is why I am sitting on the bench" even if you tell them.


Perhaps this person has played sports before but, if so, this statement doesn't hold water for any competitor. Heck, I hated to come out of a game for any reason. I worked too hard and deserved to be on the field/court. I understood that others didn't get to play and so, deserved their turn. However, it ate at me to sit. My kid is the same way.

The best tactic I've used with athletes is asking a simple question "who wants to be here". Then the follow up question is "why are we here and what are we here to do?" It's a simple and clam way of interacting with your athletes. Also, instead of talking AT them you are having a conversation. Pulling at what motivates people can really change behavior.

I don't have any problem with the above other than to say, in many places in this country, this simply won't work. In some places and cultures, this would be perceived as weakness. Say the winning programs in a school culture have aggressive coaches and one who is the psychologist, this type coach just might get pushed around. I believe a coach leads via example and makes definitive statements about their program. Then, they set high expectations. They want to lead via communication and shared goals. Every coach will find that player or two that will break the rules and push the envelope. When that happens, the coach has to make a statement about their program. JMHO!

 

[Easton33]

We are talking about kids, here, aren't we? Talking to them like people instead of throwing punishments at them makes you feel like vomiting? Interesting.

I guess if that is what u got out of it then, well I would have to resort to bench time, running, or yelling because the way you tried to turn that around on me is indicative of why some people just don't get talking (or reading).
To suggest none of the aforementioned styles of discipline do not work is simply not true. There were premier athletes, state championship teams, and even world series winners before we a had sports psychology. I believe all three are effective means of getting a players attention and none of them are outdated/archaic. The talking to happens before any of the above is used. That is when you outlined what you expect at practice, what you expect at games, and the consequences of not doing what is required. Unfortunately, I suspect no player that develops with that type of coaching will do well at higher levels of ball. Sure, that approach may do well in the butterfly leagues (C, Rec, and some HS) but when they get a hold of a coach that does all of the above, they will fold. Let's face it, the guy is just trying to drum up some business for himself. I would love to see his resume on all the sports he played and at what level.

 

[Seattlecoach]

I hate yelling but my girls respond really well to it. Ask for it even. Though I think the further between situations this happens the more effective, and with some conversation after the fact about effort and all that.

 

[dadofadirtlover]

As with discipline itself, you can't just yell. You have to make deposits in the bank before you take a withdrawal.

Very well stated CB. You could've just said this single statement and it STILL would've rung true. That's why generalities like "Always just be positive" or "Always tear into em to light the fire" are both faulty and dangerous. There are entirely too many layers to the human condition to use 1 method as an end-all be-all. That said, you can take EITHER method too far. You can be overly aggressive and badger a poor child. You can also try positive reinforcement so much that you coddle a child. As you stated, CB, you make deposits (you are balanced in how you're approaching it). We, as coaches, have a responsibility to check our drama, egos, and ideals of utpoia at the door when we are dealing with these kids......because they're kids! To think all you have to do is simply ask them "why do you want to be here?" is delusional. It's JUST as delusional as thinking that yelling at the kids from start to finish because you're "fiery". But then again, this topic of team discipline casts a huge spotlight on domicile discipline as well. So, I suspect we will run the gambit on opinions for team discipline til the cows come home (and who knows if they ever will because I love burgers).

 

[Lobster Birch]

I've never considered holding hands and singing. May have to try that...

Only if you want to win championships. Read the story pinned to the top of the coaching forum.

 

[4 girl's dad]

I've read that before but always a good read again. Thank you!

 

[JAD]

Exercise as a discipline tactic isn't particularly useful because it creates negative feelings towards fitness and exercise. Yelling and terror are only short-term answers but you lose respect. And benching is not a useful route because most people (especially teens) cannot make the connection between "I was acting up in practice and that is why I am sitting on the bench" even if you tell them. The best tactic I've used with athletes is asking a simple question "who wants to be here". Then the follow up question is "why are we here and what are we here to do?" It's a simple and clam way of interacting with your athletes. Also, instead of talking AT them you are having a conversation. Pulling at what motivates people can really change behavior.

When I read this I pictured a player laying on the bench in the dugout with a coach sitting on a bucket asking "how does that make you feel....."